Joe Louis vs Mike Tyson

Louis' power and accuracy didnt help him v max first time did it.
Close thread......
Loony tunes logic there...

 

Indeed,

Tyson has won this pole 29-18, so I think its time to close if off..

 

I consider his prime from '86-'88 when Rooney was still his trainer and Jim Jacobs was still alive as his manager. Rooney kept him sharp and Jacobs was the only person in the world he could really trust...:-(

 

Had Rooney and most of the original team Tyson held together, I think that it might have made a key difference in extending his reign, and perhaps even kept his problems outside the ring to a minimal.. This is all speculation of course, but I do feel that most of his problems were amplied right around the firing of Bill Cayton and Kevin Rooney.

 

Remember, we're talking about Tyson in his PRIME('86-'88). He never allowed this to happen when Rooney was his trainer.

 

I agree..

 

Agreed.:good

 

I disagree. As tyson got older he needed to learn how to adapt in a fight himself,and not rely on patterened methods from rooney.
Cornermen and trainers tweak the great fighters,they dont make em,or sustain em.

 

Eventually he would have broken down and lost like everyone else, but surely his reign could have lasted beyond 1990, and under the right circumstances, might even have survived a meeting with Holyfield in that same time frame.. By 1992-1994 however, retaining his title would have gotten increasingly more difficult with some of the more talented super heavyweights coming into the picture like Riddick Bowe and Lennox Lewis.. I don't think that he was going to dispatch these men in the easy fashion that he did guys like Tony Tubbs and Carl Williams... He would have to be extremely well prepared and at the top of his game in order to stay on top.... Imagine if say in 1993, he defended his belt three times back to back against Riddick Bowe, Lennox Lewis and Michael Moorer, with an additional meeting against Ray Mercer somewhere in there.. That would be a tough schedule for anyone...

 

Yes,the guys you mentioned would all be tough. I think the stint in clink is what took away tysons momentum and hunger. And i think he needed to be hungry and active to be sucessful over the long haul.
I personally feel he could have beaten all of those guys,but we will never know for sure.
And,of course he would have lost in due course given mikes 'duran like' excesses,which you cant get away with against great fighters.

 

For as highly as I think of Mike Tyson as a fighter, I don't think that he was ever destined to have a lengthy reign Joe Louis proportions.. His fighting style was of the sort, that typically did not bode well for aging, and boxing was in the dawn of a new era where heavyweights were becomming increasingly larger men. Under the absolute best of circumstances and with everything in the world working out his way, Tyson probably could have reigned to perhaps 1994, but I don't see it going much beyond that....

 

I agree. Its a hard style to maintain,especially given the dimensions of tyson,and his lifestyle. (short and squat,plus wild.)
With regard to louis' reign,is there anyone destined to have a reign like that,at any weight class?

 

I don't think so, but in all honesty, had Joe's reign as champion began in 1988, I doubt that he would have still been champion 12 years later in 2000. The 90's were packed with too many talented big heavyweights, and no way could he have defended his belt 3 times per year on a steady basis against all of them without picking up a loss or two along the way..... Mike Tyson, Evander Holyfield, Riddick Bowe, Lennox Lewis and Michael Moorer were all champions who's status ranged anywhere from very good to great, and none of them survived the dawn of the 90's without picking up their first defeats... Furthermore, that would have been a very nasty gauntlet for even someone like Muhammad Ali to have to go through..

 

Oh,i see what you mean.
Louis would no way have gone through a reign from 88+,never.
Ali would have been the best bet,but he too would pick up a loss or two. (he did even in his own time.)
See Magoo,the decade of the nineties was a golden one for heavyweight boxing.

 

Well, let's say that Joe arrived in 1988 via time travel, and decided that he was going to duplicate his reign by doing exactly the same thing that he did the first time, in defeating every single worthy challenger available, bar none....

From 1988-2000, what this would have meant is facing Michael Spinks, Mike Tyson, Evander Holyfield, Riddick Bowe, Lennox Lewis, George Foreman, Michael Moorer, Razor Ruddock, David Tua, Ray Mercer, Ike Ibeabuchi, Andre Golata, James Douglas, Oliver McCall, Frank Bruno, Chris Byrd, and perhaps even one of the Klitschko's. Now granted, its possible that some of those men may have knocked each other out of contention, especially if Louis had unified the belt, with no alpha titles available, hence he might not have had to face all of them, but still, these would have been far more treachurous waters than the ones he waded through during the 30's and 40's.....

Frankly, I can't name a single fighter who I think would have done it.... Take your pick, Ali, Louis, Holmes, Marciano, even Jesus Christ almighty..... No way..