Joe Louis. Was he a little bit "special" in the intellectual sense?

Yaca,

I view Louis as a true hero, civil rights champion ( though he does not get much press in that department ) and a great fighter! Please re-read the first sentance twice before moving on.....


Louis to me was a physical genius blessed with coordination, muscle memory reflexes, and such. However from a learning perspective, I do think he was a little slow. Perhaps this was due to his geographical and economic conditon. Perhaps Louis was a bit of a Kinesthetic learner, which means he did not learn well seeing or hearing, rather by motion, muscle memory and physical touching.


Louis’s face did not react much to comments on TV. He had this sullen look that suggests it took him a while to process information. Louis’ stategy in the ring was often absent until Blackburn told him what to do.


Sure, Louis was much better in re-matches, but the question is why? An answer is he could not figure out the other guys style in the ring, or use his own assets to the best of his ability the first time around.

Louis had every opponent out gunned. None had better speed, or power, and few had better accuracy. Furthermore he had a size and reach advantage that he failed to use well vs. smaller opponents

 

Are you a brit?

 

We have had innumerable theads talking about the very clever things he said off the cuff, some of which have become all time quotes that even non-boxing fans know. I don't think he's stupid. In fact, I read that he just had a speech impediment.

 

Props. Good to see someone from the way old school posting on a boxing forum. The legendary Stillman's, wish i coulda walked through those doors.

 

I think it boils down to two things, both of which were a sign of his times.

First, as was alluded to (sort of) before this post, Lous was essentially told to behave and act "decently." He knew these films would be distributed widely to white and black America alike, and the spector of the memory of Jack Johnson was still on the minds of his braintrust. It wouldn't do, therefore, for him to smile and crack jokes and be flippant. Too close, too soon. Be quiet, humble, and as unobtrusive as possible. That was the way to the hearts of the masses at large.

I can't believe no one mentioned that in those days, being in front of the camera was still kind of a novel thing. People were far more austere in front of a lens then, be it movie stock or still photos. How many times have you seen people whooping it up and smiling broadly in posed photos then? Not real often. Louis' rigidity was a product of that too, I believe. Rocky Marciano wasn't exactly Mr. Candor before the camera either. About as stilted and wooden as Louis was, come to think of it.

It wasn't always the Facebook generation.

 

:good

Good post, and good to see you around.

 

Yet another shocking thread by our resident sociopath. I wonder what it'll be tomorrow... Did Marcel Cerdan's forearm hair affect the speed of his punch?

 

Wow, is this a serious thread? At what point did we start analyzing the elocution of boxers? Well, to answer your question, I don't think he had a low IQ but he was not very well educated. I'm sure most fighters from this era, with the exception of a few notables, would sound like guys who grew up in working class areas with limited access to education. Actually, if you did a survey you'd probably find the situation hasn't changed all that much even today. Most fighters , regardless of their country of origin, come from working class areas and associate almost exclusively with working class people so the casual and not-so-casual observer will notice certain speech patterns that aren't really all that relevant in the grand scheme of things.

 

What? KenNorton didn't make this thread.

 

Spot on.:good

 

Theres no evidence of Louis being autistic or mentally handicapped in anyway. As many posters have pointed out he was a product of his enviroment and not a particularly educated man. Also journalists like to portray him as a simple man partly to due to their own prejudices towards him as an african american but it also has to be remembered that was part of the persona he had . He and his management wanted to distance themselves from Jack Johnson who was threatening to white america and something of an embarassment to middle class church going blacks.
His persona as simple man who wanted to learn how to read so he could read his momma the bible (i think at that point he could read already ) was merely one aspect of his character and something of a smoke screen designed to obscure the fact that he liked dressing well, jazz clubs and beautiful women.
In terms of his being autistic his ability to come up with off the cuff one liners "he can run but he cant hide " indeed he famously got the better of Ali in televised exchange . "Joe, you really think you coulda whipped me?" Louis: "When I had the title, I went on what they called a bum-of-the-month tour." Ali's voice rose three octaves: "You mean I'm a bum?" Louis: "You woulda been on the tour."
He was able to form peer group apropriate friendships and relationships . Yes his first marriage broke up but that was due to his infidelity rather than any lack of social skills.

 

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Looks like a normal person to me.

 

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by close analysis of this, and other photos of marcel cerdan I was able to reach the following conclusions:

No question the resistance from hair on his forearm slowed his punches down, but lets also consider the protective factor they gave him while defending incoming punches. the amount of arm hair (which I find to be significant) would increase the damage resistance to the structures of the arm by a factor of approximately 5%, while only decreasing his punching velocity by a factor of 2%, this an advantage that overall made marcel cerdan a 3% greater boxer!

I have also reached the conclusion, that cerdan's forearms while on early morning running exercise, were also kept warm from the early morning cold, allowing him to run even in the coldest of mornings. This as a direct result, kept cerdan in excellent physical condition.

It is obvious to me (and should be to everyone else) that this trade-off of inhibiting punching speed but protecting his arms from damage and the frigid morning air, is the main reason for his success in the middleweight division.

Anyone who dosent come to the exact same conclusions are most certainly stupid, and incapable of analyzing and interpreting even the most basic of facts.

 

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1. Making judgments about someone with hardly any evidence
2. Making observations on the evidence you don't have without any expertise in the area you're observing.

:think

Ooh, I'll give my opinion. I think Joe was manic-depressive.