Joe Louis's title defenses against Afro-American fighters

fair enough and good post. i was always under the impression that elmer ray had a very legitimate claim as well (for a time anyway)

 

Yes Ray did have a prety good claim but of course he lost to Joe Walcott before the issue was forced. By this time Louis had become a relativley inactive champion.

There were elements of the press who acused Louis of avoiding Ray. In practice Louis might have been smarter to take the fight with Ray in order to steer clear of Walcott.

The other thing that has to be said about Ray, is that like Walcott he did not enjoy the advantages of a good manager and suport system untill late in his career. Of course, unlike Walcott he did not have a style suited for longevity.

 

very true, the thing is at the time i can certainly imagine given his punching power, ray must have looked like a significantly more dangerous opponent than walcott. even if he lost head to head, ray would seem (imo) to be more superficially the bigger threat. in the end though, i don't see him ever causing louis the problems walcott did and in a shootout, he's a dead man

 

Back then, it was a black hole (no pun) and career suicide for black heavies back then to fight other black heavies, particularly in Louis' climb to the title shot. It was apart of Louis' teams' plan to ensure he'd get his shot. The memory of Jack Johnson scared boxing fans and critics half to death so many years later.

 

There seems to have been a rift between Louis and his managment on the issue.

He took the fight with John Henry Lewis against the wishes of his managers, but the fight drew a low gate for a Louis bout. Earlier he wanted to offer a title shot to Leroy Haynes but was over ruled.

 

It is important to focus on the fact that a champion cannot see any fight that happens in the future. They do not know which prospects will go on to great things and which will be busts. I also notice the phenomenon that taking on a puncher is often less apealing, even to a fighter who is more vulnerable to a technician. They make assesments based on what they see at the time and somtimes the fighters they judge to be the biggest threat seem baffling with the benefit of hindsight.

Louis himself said that the only man his team were afraid of was Melio Betina!

In the final event Louis did knock Ray out twice. They had a "friendly" exhibition after Louis retired and Ray decided to make it decidedly unfriendly. Louis responded by knocking him sensless. They fought a second exhibition with the same result.

 

did not know that. poor ray...you don't pick a fight with one of the greatest finishers in heavyweight history and not expect to get knocked out

 

all in all though, the fight with lewis was nothing more than a favour to a friend. a last gift of a decent paycheck before he retired

 

Yes and no.

Lewis was on a quick slide to oblivion due to his eyes, but he was still a ranked heavyweight contender (#7 I think) coming off some good wins.

Today this would be regarded as a relativley bold title defence!

 

Joe Lewis gave his friend John Henry Lewis, LH champion a shot at one last money bout, because John Henry was blind in one eye and losing sight of the other orbit...In 1939 , Louis kod his pal in one round,saving JH Lewis
further punishment...Lewis was just 25 years old at the time...As a young boy, I lived next door to John Henry Lewis's trainer...

 

atsch Now I know why SNV wears one after this thread!

 

Who were the Black heavyweights during his day? Jimmy Bivens, Lem Franklin, Elmer Ray & Lee Q. Murry? I think even without them on his resume. Louis is the best heavyweight of all time. I also rank him at 6 in my all time pound for pound list. I really think he would have beaten all of them had they fought. He and Bivens did fight, but not till latter in their careers.
While there wasn't a color line in the 1930's and 1940's it was very diffcult for Black boxers to get championship fights even against Black Champions. It's a fair criticism of any champion including Louis of that eara. I do think that he could have found away to fight at least one of them. Like I said I think he would have won.

 

Louis should have fought lem franklin.

 

:rofl BE please give Conn a 'fro.

 

He was going to in September 1942. All "Lammin' Lem" had to do was beat Bob Pastor. Unfortunately, he didn't (Pastor KO8 Franklin)