Joey Maxim at heavyweight

For what possible reason?

Wills lost to a top twenty heavyweight, all time. Maxim lost to a guy with almost no heavyweight resume. It's a ridiculous comparison in terms of legacy affection.

 

What, for pretending that losing to Langford is comparable to losing to Marshall because of size?

I'm not "giving him a hard time", i'm appraising a loss.

The difference has been explained to you. If you don't accept that, there's nothing to be done about that. If you stop thinking in terms of size and start thinking in terms of quality - what Langford and Marshall did respectively at heavyweight, where Maxim is ranked for the purpose of this conversation, that would be a start.

who said it was worse? It is though.

 

He was a 168lbs, and has really weak achievement at HW. The fact that he is 168lbs is alarming because, without possibility of reasonable counter argument, a top top heavyweight - or cruiserweight - should not lose to a fighter of that weight, no matter how good. Journeyman, yes, fringe contenders, yes. This should not happen to a special heavyweight. Great heavy/cruisers in their prime, no. That's a horrible loss.

Losing to a fighter with almost literally nothing to recommend him at the weight is also more than a little disturbing, in whatever circumstances.

It's a hideous loss. If you want to say Maxim has worse losses, i'm fine with that. It's also bizarre. If Maxim were black, probably it's the type of fight where people would start saying Maxim was cuffed.

Well if you extend that thinking to your Wills-Langford comparison, you'll understand why it was a little silly.

 

Come on now, you must know you are reaching with this. It's a little dishonest. Sheppard was fought at light-heavyweight. Yes, it makes a difference. A light-heavyweight is easier for a 165lb fighter to handle, you know?

Bivins KTFO Marshall. At 175lbs So this is basically BS for me. I rank fighters for what they do at their weights, you know? Not the one bewlos.

Well history probably doesn't look at all, but I think it depends on what you mean. I think the last generation of historians would be forgiving, but your really think a more modern commentator is going to see it that way? Because I don't.

Hideous loss.

I was trying to be polite. It was ****ing stupid.

 

But they were light-heayvweights. Because this absolutely excludes them from my determining Maxim's rank at HW/Marshall's status at HW, I won't be addressing the point again. It is of no interest to me, literally none. I don't want to waste time arguing with you from a totally different platform.

Yes.

It's valid to feel around for similar weight issues surrounding the argument, I suppose, but again, it absolutely does not appeal to me on any level at all. Losing to Langford at HW, of course, losing to Marshall at HW, wtf.

 

Harry Greb set the benchmark for sure...he's reason two from my earlier post on that matter. I think the slip-stream affect for other great fighters from that era generally helps to balance out that schedule thing.

Conn was a better puncher at HW, as to whether he improved outside that, I don't know.

 

I think it is. But, agree to disagree, it hardly matters.

I think it's a bad loss because he's far to small to be beating a top HW and did nothing at HW. I've repeated myself for the last time on this though. I think that's a normal reaction to that type of loss, if you feel differently, that's fine.

Marshall is absolutely not in the class of Charles and Moore for greatness, that's silly.

If Maxim is vulnerable to a large slew of fighters who weigh 168lbs, I would say it is very bad for his HW legacy. Fortunately, I don't believe that to be the case, I think you are rather hard on poor Maxim.

Do you think Calzaghe would beat him?

 

That's just some weird phrase though. I could equally say "ultra-elite" or "fandabbydozy". What he's not, is in the class of Charles and Moore, who are my #1 and #2 all time. Marshall is significantly below that. He didn't make the top 25 in the ESB 175 poll, which is probably harsh, but he's only in "absolutely elite" if there's another arbitrary category above that that contains the division's greatest.

Marshall was elite at 168lbs on the night he beat Maxim, and Calzaghe was mostly elite at 168lbs too. Bigger, in fact, which constitutes a small advantage over Marshall. So it seems a reasonable question. But of course, you knew exactly what I meant and decided to ask a question rather than answer one.