John L Sullivan v.s Jack Dempsey

What size are the gloves? What are the rules on clinching? Sullivan would have difficulty landing on a whirlwind like Dempsey, but he was quite strong and savvy in the clinches, and his right hand (a punch Dempsey was vulnerable to) was considered incredible. Nevertheless, I'd go with Dempsey by knockout here--boxing in Sullivan's time did not account for the midrange hook that emerged from the rulechanges of the early 20th century.

We really don't have the footage to judge, though.

 

Sullivan by KO.

 

Dempsey by ko late ,too fast afoot and too elusive with his bobbing and weaving for John L to land his big right hand wallop,Sullivan was seldom in the condition Jack was,Dempsey hooks to the body would slow down the old brawler,and his short power shots would halt his rhino charges.

 

I agree. They both were great, there is little doubt about that one. I often wish I could go back in time and watch one of prime Sullivan's fights.. as should be the wish of any clasic boxing fan imo as he was the first real "superstar" of the sport.

 

Dempsey.
No doubt about it.

 

Care to explain your reasoning?

Without footage of Sullivan what makes you reach such a definite conclusion?

 

In case you haven't seen it, there is a 30 second blurb video on you tube of Sullivan and Corbett mugging for the camera, I think at Jefferies training camp. Funny, Sullivan with the big mustache. Anyway towards the end he fakes throwing an overhand right,and for a split second I think you can see really some fire in the old man's eyes. just thought you would get a kick out of it.:good

 

Thanks for the reminder, Mike! That is a good, albeit past prime , clip.

 

Two guys with explosive punching power, quick hands, aggresive, and they moved like big cats. Sullivan a bigger guy, despite coming along several decades earlier. Both two handed, though Sullivan became reliant on the right in the latter part of his career (after breaking the left in the Cardiff fight). Dempsey a bit more noted for his left, and a bit noted for taking hard rights. Both good stamina, though I get the impression Sullivan's (when he trained) struck contemporaries as more special.

Time-machining greats together, I'll near always take other top-15 historical heavies over Sullivan (in a Queensbery), because they are more able to specialize in Qeensbery techniques, and because I think their competition would better give them a base of experience than John L's would have. However, in potens, I think Sullivan was very special, a great among the greats, and I would pick him over most other top-15 heavies, on the basis of being born into, and peaking, in their time.

Time machined together from their respective eras, I make Dempsey a moderate favorite; developing in each others day, I slightly favor Sullivan.

 

Sullivan and Dempsey essentially had the same aggressive swarming style, coming forward trying to knock your head off using two-fisted punching power. Only Sullivan was bigger, stronger, and faster.

 

Dempsey By Midround Maybe 6-7 Ko They Were Both Strong And Tough Swarmers But Most People Dont Remember Jack Could Really Box Well When He Wanted To,his Speed And Skill Would Just Outclass The Tough Scrapper Sullivan

 

Sullivan wasn't "undersized" like Fitz or Corbett, correct?

 

Sullivan was between 5 10 and 5 10 1/2,and weighed 198 in shape.