Johnson reneged on agreement to fight Langford

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Cmoyle, Feb 5, 2013.


  1. Cmoyle

    Cmoyle Active Member Full Member

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  2. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    I believe Johnson also said he did not consider himself bound by any contract that his then manager Sam Fitzpatrick had signed whilst he stood outside in the corridor not being granted entry into the hallowed offices of the NSC. coming back from " Down Under "as Champion Johnson was without Fitzpatrick I think.

    Johnson as the challenger agreed to fight Burns for £1000 later increased to £1500 or $5000 if you prefer ,he would be a bit of a mug to defend his new title for £1000 would he not?
    It is said Johnson resented being relegated to the role of "servile ****** "whilst his future was decided in a room from which he was barred access.
    Whatever, if he signed the document he should have fulfilled his obligation, but the autocratic Bettinson was notorious for his parsimony regarding fighters purses, strange because in other respects he was a generous man.
    As you are well aware,Langford received his career best purse for fighting Iron Hague.
    Below
    Johnson refuses to fight Langford for £1000 agrees to £6000.

    Personally , I think Johnson preferred to knockover Flynn and co ,easier pickings for which only fair condition was needed.

    http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/7225662
     
  3. Cmoyle

    Cmoyle Active Member Full Member

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    That was the point I wanted to make. If Johnson really signed the agreement as Bettinson claimed and reportedly provided proof of as stated in the next to last paragraph of my post he should have lived up to his obligation. Nobody forced them to accept the offer to fund their trip to Australia so he could fight Burn in exchange for the agreement to return and fight Langford should he win the title. It was a bit of a game on the club's part as Johnson was under no obligation to repay the funds had he lost to Burns.
     
  4. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    I totally agree, Johnson should have honoured his agreement.

    I also think Bettinson was being less than reasonable with his terms knowing full well that Johnson's bargaining power would be considerably increased as champion.
    What is your take on Mullins opinion regarding Johnson v Langford post 1908? It seems to reverse conventional theories of their respective chances.
     
  5. Cmoyle

    Cmoyle Active Member Full Member

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    "What is your take on Mullins opinion regarding Johnson v Langford post 1908? It seems to reverse conventional theories of their respective chances. "

    I saw your post on the thread you started on that topic. I have a series of Mullins newspaper memoir articles at home and I don't remember some of the statements you posted exactly the same way so I'd like to consult that specific article again. But, I do recall Mullins saying that he thought Langford's best chance against Johnson would have been prior to when Johnson won the title rather than after because he felt Langford lost some of his speed when he continued to put on weight after that. It is interesting because as you say it goes against what many others said. I think it's difficult to discount his opinion given that he trained both men at different times. He would seem to me to be as qualified as anyone to judge the matter.
     
  6. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Thanks for your input.:good
     
  7. apollack

    apollack Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Question is whether Johnson actually signed. I think Fitzpatrick signed for him. After Johnson won the championship and got paid relatively little in order to do it, and saw that Burns got $30,000 to fight him, it became Johnson's mantra that he wanted 30k just like Burns if he was going to fight a tough foe.
     
  8. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Glad you got into this.
    I think Johnson was being entirely reasonable putting his asking price for a title defence at $30,000. He made considerably more from other ventures in Aussie than he did from winning the title from Burns, but you know this already.
     
  9. Cmoyle

    Cmoyle Active Member Full Member

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    "Question is whether Johnson actually signed. I think Fitzpatrick signed for him. After Johnson won the championship and got paid relatively little in order to do it, and saw that Burns got $30,000 to fight him, it became Johnson's mantra that he wanted 30k just like Burns if he was going to fight a tough foe. "

    I guess the thing to do would be to track down the photo of the signature that it says ran ran in the Morning World. According to what I found and posted, they ran a photo of the document with his signature.
     
  10. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    When you consider that Jeffries received $27,056 for challenging Fitzsimmons,in 1899 ,and Fitz walked away with $35,581.The NSC's offer
    of£1,000 [approximately $3000,] looks rather paltry, especially given the inflation over those years.

    Below a porky looking Langford in 1913, Sam McVey is in the background, two behind Sam. That looks like Wills with his arms folded on the left.


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  11. Cmoyle

    Cmoyle Active Member Full Member

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    "When you consider that Jeffries received $27,056 for challenging Fitzsimmons,in 1899 ,and Fitz walked away with $35,581.The NSC's offer
    of£1,000 [approximately $3000,] looks rather paltry, especially given the inflation over those years."

    Again, he didn't have to accept their offer to finance his trip to Australia. And, I'd wager that we'd find it was his signature on that agreement with the NSC.
     
  12. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    If he signed it he should have kept his word , but he isn't the first person to have broken it, and he wont be the last.

    No one said he was a paragon of virtue, I'm more concerned with his ability as a boxer than his probity as an upstanding citizen.
     
  13. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

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    If he did sign why not not take him to court? That'd be standard business practise
     
  14. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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  15. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    You'd wager? You mean you aren't positive? I thought you were certain he signed it? Here are your comments from an earlier post on CBZ.

    "Johnson maintained that the money offered by the club was insufficient and that his manager had signed the agreement without his approval. The National Sporting Club countered by producing the document that Johnson himself had signed. It was to no avail: Johnson had other plans. Over the ensuing years Langford and his manager, Joe Woodman, hounded Johnson in futile pursuit of an opportunity to fight for the heavyweight championship.
    “Nobody will pay to see two black men fight for the title,” Johnson rationalized"


    I'm confused now, do you have definitive proof he signed the contract or not? :huh