I've watched this numerous times and still feel the same way, Johnson was carrying him, in the second round the announcer said the crowd was yelling for Johnson to fight and quit holding and after he dropped Ketchel he acted like nothing had happened, and just boxed. Later I think it was round 10 the announcer stated the obvious, Johnson could ko Ketchel anytime he wanted to. As for the knock down I think it was legitimate ,Jack was careless and was caught off guard and dropped. I mean Jack was punishing , and playing with him, why would he let himself be knocked down? What Johnson then did to Ketchel he could have done at anytime, put him to sleep.
Have to agree. I think a modern boxer would give both of these guys a pasting and I'm not even talking Holmes or Lewis. I'd bet guys like Morrison, Mercer and Dokes would send them to the hospital.
Johnson looked in excellent condition and he was carrying Ketchel there's no doubt. Johnson was catching Ketchel with those left jabs full in the chops and he was like a cat, albeit a big one, playing with a bird or mouse. The commentator mentioned the two men hating one another which wasn't what I've heard.
Unforgivable Blackness n Black man v the world r definitely on my wishlist too. Needa dive more into Johnson so thx for helping w that process.
Thanks, Rezzi. Ketchel had to have massive cojones to step in there with Johnson and then 6 months later with Sam Langford. However, he looks awful in films we have of his, expecially the Papke fight. Looks uncoordinated, unskilled and had zero technique, like no head movement at all. Kind of an early Riccardo Mayorga. I believe I've read somewhere that Johnson agreed to carry Ketchel for the 20 rounds. I think the idea that Johnson was wiping off Ketchel's teeth was ridiculous; probably just wiping off debris from the canvas.
It was a heavyweight vs middleweight. I would not use this film to "Judge" Johnson on his skill level since he was out right carrying Ketchel. As said before what Johnson did in the 14th round, he could of done at any time from round 1-14. If Tyson went all out on say Marvin Hagler or what happens if Jake Lamotta did get that fight vs Joe Louis?? They are all going out in 1 or 2 rounds if it was on the level.
the thing Most Present, though a great Film Improvement, they 'can't fix' what the original Filming DIDN'T Capture and that always seems to be Most of the Actual FIGHTING ... So much OLD Footage, only managed to capture, pawing, parriyng, slow measuring uo and of course Grabbing, it always misses the actual punching & fighting , it's as if Fast Movement Couldn't be caught right by MOST Old Film Footage. because real fighting, in any age of human history, has always been busy & much more active.
Ernie Roderick was a 1st Class tough & beautiful boxer, who could have won a World Welterweight Title in his own right. I have always said Roderick vs Zivic should've happened, and would have, absent of a world at war, that fight would have been a great showdown.
So the old film footage had trouble capturing the good boxing, but had more success recording the bad? That's your theory now?
I won’t describe his glove wiping actions in detail - but you can see he’s wiping the wrong glove (read: not the glove the teeth were supposedly embedded in). Suffice to say, it was often claimed back then that multiple teeth were lost in fights. I know there were no gum shields but even Willard denied the claims that he lost teeth vs Dempsey. I will say that I think there was truth to Liston knocking out several of Bethea’s teeth, especially given the way the ref very carefully removes Wayne’s mouthpiece and looks into it.
