Jose Napoles Discussion

brilliant welter weight champ dominated for a long time and an top 5 ATG great welter

had a brilliant jab

ill watch afew videos of him because i havent watched in a while and tell you more

 

It was a major issue for him..the cutting that is.

More then likely not as bad as any fighter that ever lived but for an elite level fighter of the status he had it was pretty bad. His name and cuts are synonymous.

He probably sits at no5 in my list...some might have him lower with guys like Robinson, Leonard, Armstrong, Hearns, Gavilan, Griffith being argued in front of him.
Easily top 10..that one is not up for debate.

He is a fighter who I always knew about but didnt really research in any real length to just recently aswell. Its only probably been the last year that Ive watched a lot more of him on film..more then likely I was underwhelmed to first time I saw him and never sort to see to much more of him till recently. But I think he is just the tits and right now is one of my favourite fighters to watch..Truly smooth as butter as moniker suggests.

 

A fantastic fighter,to my shame someone only in the last couple of months i have started to study in depth, his footwork and balance is as good as any fighter i have ever seen, top notch. He always seemed to be in the right position. Beautiful to watch, his combinations flow together seamlessly, also good power and fast hands.

I have him in the top 5 at welter, if he didn't cut so easily i think he would be right there with robinson and leonard. Here's some good footage

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Wow great fighter. Top 5 ATG WW

 

Probably my second favorite fighter of all time behind Whitaker. One of the most beautiful stylists to watch on film, and a damn near flawless technician. His footwork was impeccable, perfect balance, distance control, ring generalship, etc. His offensive arsenal involved some of the most accurate and efficient hook/uppercut combinations you'll ever see, along with a sharp jab made difficult to counter due to his excellent head movement and range control. Everything just seemed to flow in order for him, he really was as smooth as butter, hence his nickname Mantequilla.

In reality he was more of a natural 135-140 pounder than a WW, but considering he was never given a title shot at those weights (despite beating everyone he needed to beat and being clearly among the very best, I'd have favored him over Ortiz), he decided to move on up to WW where he finally received his shot against Cokes, whom he impressively dismantled in two flawless performance. After that he tried his hand against Emile Griffith (who admittedly was not at his best at this stage due to the fact that he'd been recently campaigning as a MW and had to drain himself to get back down) and won in similarly dominating fashion, winning a wide, one-sided UD and dropping Griffith. Though his resume isn't as stacked due to the shorter time frame he had to work in the WW division because of his earlier career, he was without question one of the most skilled and dominant WW champions of all time, and would've been a live underdog against pretty much any of them.

The only WW's I'd handily favor over him are Robinson and Leonard. Guys like Rodriguez, Gavilan, and a prime Griffith are difficult calls, as are Hearns, Basilio, Burley, etc.

 

..............His nickname suits him perfectly; he really was smooth, perhaps the most seamless fighter I can remember seeing. Just beautiful to watch.

I think he sometimes gets overlooked by more casual fans because he never had wha one would call a great fight in term of action to harken back to; all his efforts seem to have been rather controlled, sort of like Monzon in that regard.


What an educated left hand. If you watch him for any appreciable time, you soon pick out just how relatively infrequently he threw the right. That, and the other thing that stands out to me is how he was always right there in front of you, but so damn hard to hit cleanly, and he was one of the very best counterpunchers imaginable.

 

Amazing fighter, smooth as butter. Was a boxer in Cuba, though after he defected to Mexico, he became a KO artist. He is well loved in Mexico and well, he's an all-time great.

He won his first pro fight by KO on the very first punch he threw as a professional.

Here's a vid of Mantequilla:

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Mantequilla thoroughly chewed up and spi out a class-A welterweight champion in Curtis Cokes. Both their fights ended almost identically, with Cokes looking like a truly pathetic looking swollen and battered old pug, except he was on top of the world and ruling the welter roost for a couple of years. Napoles would do THE VERY SAME THING to Margarita, Cotto, Mosely, De La Hoya, etc.,...His only flaw was his tendency to cut and swell, but if he nailed you, it was like lightning in a bottle, and you'd be toast. He was fantastic.

 

I'd rate him top 3 with his sublime technical and natural ability and great championship reign combined, which is amazing considering hes a natural 135lber, fighting at that weight upto the age of 28.

I don't think Hearns/Burley should be rated over him with both having only a short stay at the weight and both being young and not technically peaked at the weight. Hes a better boxer than Griffith and proved it in the ring and by being more consistent. Yes Griffith may have been slightly drained, but Griffith also had the advantage of fighting a natural LW who he was outmuscling, Napoles dominated him though. For me he seems overall a much more complete fighter than Galivan, and more dominant at the weight

In a way he was reminicent of a not quite as athletic version of Ray Robinson but with a better radar/slipping and inside game. Certainly not quite as physically gifted as either of the Sugar Ray's but not a world away

The boxing skills of Napoles seems similar to other greats of the era like Loche and Ortiz but with more physical ability and a better combination thrower.

 

The 2 Sugars, Robinson and Leonard. Leonard's a bit difficult to judge, only going 6-1 in Welterweight title fights. But he does arguably have the best 3 wins in WW history and 1 of the few to beat a top3 great MW champ alongside clearly being 1 of the most accomplished skillsets and physically ability we've seen.

At WW though who knows what would have happened if he'd not got the eye injury against Hearns, gave Hearns a rematch, Duran a rubber, Pryor a fight, then defended against the young upstarts like Curry. He could have an ever greater legacy or have met his match again.

You could make an argument Robinson shouldn't be number 1 due to the avoidance of Burley, Holman Williams and co, but thats all politics and he was just was too good at and around the weight.

 

Both burley and williams where pretty much fighting around middleweight from about 42 to 43 i'm pretty sure, so ray not fighting then can perhaps hurt his all round legacy but not really at 147 if they weren't fighting at the weight IMO

 

Much more complete than Gavilan? That's stretching it, as Gavilan was one of the most versatile boxers and stylists of all time.

 

I think Burley would have come down to WW up until '43-'45, and at 1 stage was Robinson's potential biggest purse to date. Burley left WW after Zivic's management bought out his contract and squeezed him out of the title picture. But we really need our resident Burley experts opinion on this.