Jose Napoles vs..?

*Shrugs* Mayweather is better than Napoles

 

Yeah I didn't put that much depth into my response because I really didn't feel the need to, perhaps I wouldn't have gotten jumped so hard if I had

 

@ 135 I'll take Mantequilla over Pernell Whitaker with his better firepower. Against Williams it's 50/50. I slightly favor a peak Duran over Napoles but what a fight that would have been. I think Duran's toughness, versatility, craft, and full on aggression would eventually overwhelm Napoles.

@ 140 I favor Napoles over Pryor, I think Pryor's style would play into Napole's hands.
The Pacquiao who fought Hatton is a 50/50 fight for me. Not sure why people are underselling Pac's abilities but he's an ATG for a reason. Napoles was like an aggressive JMM but had that tendency to cut bad, which Pac could take advantage of with his speed and power. Pac would still be a hard, competitive fight for Mantequilla and I can see it being a hellacious battle between 2 ATG monsters.

@147 I'll favor Napoles over Curry in a violent chess match where the first 6 rounds is competitive until Napoles picks up the pace and batters him in the late rounds. Against Kid Gavilan I think it's a 50/50 fight as well. This would also be a cracking fight between 2 of the best Cuban fighters.

 

Napoles like Johnson and Giardello? I think you need to watch more Napoles. He has much more similarities to his compatriots Rodriguez and Chocolate than either of them. Hell, his head movement and foot positioning is much more similar to Canzoneri.

No one really denigrates Hopkins. If anything, people overrated him some in my opinion. He's a divided figure here.

And Graziano was not a great fighter. He has that win over post ware Zale. That's it. Who he also lost to.

And honestly, that's just pretty ignorant regarding Steele and Gavilan, especially H2H. If you can't see The Hawk for what he is at Welter, I honestly don't know what to say. The guy was close to unbrawlable 147. Even Robinson had to box him. Not fight. Box. He could box, brawl, adamantium chin, length, IQ, unorthodox, endless stamina. The only thing that slightly hampered him was power.

And the only way Steele gets convincingly beat at his weight is by stylistic advantage. The guy was as dominant a champion as you can get and had all the ingredients and talent of a H2H ATG.

And regarding Pacquiao, you think Napoles couldn't land that Marquez esque punch? He would, and he could. Napoles hit harder than Marquez, was a better mover, had better defense and a better brain. No one denies the greatness of Pac H2H, but the lunging punches would seal his doom IMO.

And honestly, Napoles is a horrible horrible style for Ross. One of the worst I can think of. Ross was a boxer puncher who could pressure, but wasn't frantic, or hold the center and box findamentally. He didn't have fast feet. He would bait him with his head and foot positioning, content switches, ten times what Canzoneri did to him, and has the power to make him think twice. Ross would have his moments and go the distance, but it would be clear who was better.

And you cannot rely on cuts for a match up here IMO. It is way too unpredictable. I never predict cuts stoppages on here.

Napoles may be a top 10 H2H fighter ever.

 

To me I think Napoles is one of the best fighters H2H around his weight class. The only fighters I would not hesitate to pick against him would be Sugar Ray Leonard, Thomas Hearns, and Sugar Ray Robinson. You need to have the speed, size, power, chin, and intangibles to convincingly beat a prime Mantequilla.

 

Nope I don't understand that call. And I called the Mayweather fans crazy.......

 

Nope clearly underrated. He's an atg and top 50 p4per, most of the people in placed like r/boxing rank him top 10/20 p4p and think he's only able to be beaten by prime Roy Jones Jr more times than not at his best. Yet here people were favoring Joey Giardello and the like over him

Bad power, limbs too long and too feather fisted to be unbeatable in an infight. LaMotta was better in that department, Robinson was always beaten on the inside by LaMotta as well. Gavilan was beaten on the outside before, he's not perfect there.

Serviceable power but nothing outstanding, an overrated chin, good fundamentals, a good undefeated streak. His true standout areas were adaptability, stamina and iq. 2 year title reign. What an unbeatable fighter. I think he was good, if anything he underachieved in his era for his talents. Weak win list, not a long time as champ. Yet people here rank him as like a top 10 mw if not top 5 and top 50 p4p

Napoles wouldn't be as bold as Marquez, Marquez had the chin to brush aside Pac's punches. Napoles would probably be forced back and be mostly on the defensive for fear of KO

 

This alone shows that you don't know what you're talking about...but you seem willing to bask...to luxuriate...in your ignorance.

 

yeah my ignorance has a 500 thread count, its really comfy to lay in

 

Well this has been fun Lol

anyway Gavilan vs Napoles is one of my dream fights that I have never really been able to pick a winner in.

I think 50/50 with Gavilan
Slightly favor Duran just because I only recall seeing Napoles fight Urbina at that weight and don’t feel I have enough to go on...perhaps 50/50 would be a better take?

I think he beats the rest....I am ultra confident saying no way in the living hell does Pac beat Napoles though

 

hopkins is a strange case perhaps only comparable to FMJ on this forum where some like me rate him extremely high overall and h2h and feel the forum does not like him and is vastly underrated...on the flip side many (very many) don’t think highly of him at all and that he would lose to most very good to great fighters. I think he has mire detractors than appreciators so I disagree with you in that regard...but I do agree that he is a very divided figure!

 

I hate defending hopkins because i dislike him as a person but he truly is underrated

 

You're talking about r/boxing like it means something. The posters there are pretty much casuals and their knowledge is not in depth.

Marquez the natural Featherweight has a better chin than Napoles who took the punches of Backus, Lopez, Cokes and Griffith and Monzon? Seriously? The only problem with Napoles was that he cut.

More bold? Marquez was a natural counter puncher who didn't like to lead. He only held his feet in the aggressive Nacho manner. Chris John for example showed this, and Marquez looked awful here, lunging with his punches and just generally missing and being out positioned at times. Napoles was a naturally aggressive fighter with better defense. Not bold? He took the fight to ****ing Carlos Monzon straight away, maybe the greatest middleweight ever. He absolutely destroyed the underrated Cokes. And this is just at 147 and 160, not even 140! Laughable statement in all honesty.

Your posts are showing me you have not watched these fighters in depth at all, particularly Napoles.

 

I watched the Monzon fight a few times, notice how Monzon destroyed him, contrast this with Duran who beat Barkley and held his own against Hagler. And you know what I meant, Marquez took a chance with that one in a million counter punch from God that he landed on Pac. If Pac had landed first Marquez would've survived, Napoles wouldve been shook to his core

Your appeal to authority has no power here. I haven't watched as much Napoles footage as you, but I've watched his important fights.

 

Lol Napoles was a natural 135 to 140 pounder, against the greatest middleweight ever with an awful style and real big for the weight. And he was winning rounds! Duran from the Barkley fight wouldn't do to well against a prime Monzon either. And Napoles took prolonged punishment from Monzon's accurate volley of punches for rounds. 'Shook to his boots'. Getting ridiculous now. Napoles had a very, very good chin and an even better defense.

And Napoles wouldn't take a 1 in 1 million chance, because he wouldn't need to. He is levels above Marquez, which is saying something. Napoles aggressive workrate, defense and power would help him dismantle Pacquaio's lunging power punches in a great fight. Speaking of workrate as you mentioned, Napoles was an extremely fit fighter and was only ever really outworked in the first Muniz bout, where he was a borderline alcoholic and had a bad cut. Prime Napoles is all the way there with Pacquiao's workrate, even a Duran or Gavilan workrate.

How can you argue this and then admit you haven't watched much footage? It not an appeal to authority when you literally haven't watched the bouts and fighters you are trying to debate against.