Joseph "Baby Joe" Mesi - ceiling?

In a parellel dimension where the Pride of Tonawanda never suffers that pair of subdural hematomae, what is the furthest we could see him going?

I remember in his career's twilight and its aftermath, opinions varied wildly - from "he could have / should have / would have captured HW title gold" to "he was a glorified clubfighter".

The salient facts are that he fought professionally for a full decade before retiring an undefeated ranked contender - but really only faced decent opposition for a period of not even three full years (from JorGon in April 2001 until Jirov in March of 2004). In that eleven bout span, only six were names anybody would recognize: Jorge "El León" González, "Smokin" Bertram Cooper, David Izonritei, Davarryl "Touch of Sleep" Williamson, Monte "2 Gunz" Barrett, and Vassiliy "The Tiger" Jirov.

Even that list of a half dozen names is paltry, with lots of gristle hiding the bit of quality meat on the bone. Two washed-up former title challengers, two contemporaries occupying the mediocre fringes of contention, one Nigerian glass cannon who nabbed silver at the Olympics but fizzled in the pros, and really arguably just a single opponent that came anywhere near being a great in their prime: Jirov. That is without doubt Mesi's finest victory - but a pyrrhic one, that basically cost him any further competitive future in the sport.

In his attempted comeback in 2006 and 2007, he was licensed by various local commissions of dubious repute but faced not a single live body. Nevada rightfully wouldn't sanction him - nor would his own home state of New York. This effectively ruled out any championship opportunities at the notable venues featured on cable broadcasters like HBO and Showtime and relegated him to backwater mismatches. This second run ended with a sputter to little fanfare.

Now, disregarding everything prior to González and past Jirov and focusing in on just that mercurial prime with reasonable competition - how do we think Mesi shaped up? Could a belt have been within his reach? In the period immediately following the brain damage he recieved in his UD over the Kazakh, the following men were all strapped up for a time: Chris Byrd (IBF), Lamon Brewster (WBO), Vitali Klitschko (WBC), Hasim Rahman (WBC), Nikolai Valuev (WBA), Siarhei Liakhovich (WBO), Wladimir Klitschko (IBF), Oleg Maskaev (WBC), Shannon Briggs (WBO).

I don't for a second think even the best version of Mesi we saw has a chance against K2. Byrd would probably outbox him cleanly as well. The rest, however, is for a variety of individual reasons, a relatively weak field.

It can be hard to get a bead on this sort of thing. Boxing is replete with mythicized "what-if" stories who didn't realize their full potential due to death, injury, or any number of derailments outside the ring. You have your Tyrone Everett, for instance, and Dmitry Pirog. Then you have Sal Sánchez, who had already achieved a ton, but imagine if he hadn't crashed how much more he could have adorned his legacy?

So it's tricky waters to navigate - on the one side, avoid erring on the side of romanticizing the hypothetical, and on the other don't overcompensate for that and end up actually underrating someone's chances. Realistically, objectively, based on the film of his small handful of meaningful bouts, does Mesi enter the history books with even a piece of the alphabet pie?

 

Just said the same in the General Forum version of the thread:

 

Apparently his son's fighting now. Joseph Jr., heavyweight based in Buffalo like his dad...won the New York State Golden Gloves last year.

That is very marketable as a "universe dealing the family a second hand" story, if he winds up being any good as a pro.

 

Not only was Vitali a lot bigger, there isn't a single aspect of the game where he wasn't demonstrably much better than Mesi. That would indeed have been a massacre.

 

Funny - he just popped into my head randomly, and in the course of googling his name this very thread (made by me a week and one year ago today) was on the first page of hits.

Also found this hilarious old thread from 2007 with people mercilessly roasting the OP for even suggesting a Joe vs. Wlad matchup.

https://www.boxingforum24.com/threads/mesi-klitschko-2k8-who-takes-it.13805/

 

It was actually @Devon's "Why do fighters that retired undefeated get **** all over?" thread which got the ball rolling... I was going to make a flippant remark about how nobody puts respect on the name of Baby Joe the heavyweight GOAT. Then fell down a rabbit hole of casually re-researching the guy.