i dont think Ortiz is old. he looked good vs kauffman and vs cojanu. and of Course vs wilder. still, i just believe joyce could be Special. he reminds me of a Young Foreman. what sets him apart is his great stammina. his punchoutput is crazy for a Heavyweight. add his size and power...…….and you got a real Nightmare. so i pick joyce to win. not because Ortiz is old…...but because joyce is simply better.