Julio Caesar Chavez, has his "star" faded?

Only if Pernell Whitaker hadn't been born.

Then again, if Whitaker had never been born perhaps even welterweight wouldn't have been a problem for him. I think Buddy was a winnable fight for Chavez considering styles.

By the way, some were thinking he could be up there with Ray Robinson or even surpass him when he was on a tear.

 

Definitely, he was massive at one point. though i felt he was overestimated by quite some distance for the latter half of his active career.Too many people seemed to still see him as the Chavez of the Rosario and earlier fights, even as he was obviously getting slower and more workmanlike\less dynamic at 140 as the 90s era kicked in.


I'd rather have him stay at lightweight, carve out a title run there and fight Whitaker earlier.Maybe a series with both nearer peak.

This said, with the dust long settled on his career, he seems to be rated quite smartly by most posters around here.Definitely not dismissed or obviously underestimated too often.

 

most successful world title defenses in history, more than twice as much as duran.
undefeated in his first 90 fights, definately GOAT

 

Not as good as Duran, that much can be seen on film. At 130 and even more so at 135, he was one of the best fighters ever though.

 

I rank him very highly.

By the time he made the consciousness of the larger American audience, he had already peaked and was sort of sustaining before his long slide down.

 

Lightweight Floyd struggled mightily with his sparring partner. That oughta answa dat!

 

I doubt it personally, I rate Floyd very highly. But educated pressure is not the same as regular aggression, and Chavez is potentially the goat when it comes to educated pressure. Chavez was also very capable with his boxing ability at range, he was comfortable there, had a good defence, a good jab, good movement, though not excessive, and his straight right was his best punch, very accurate from varying ranges.

 

Only in one of their fights. I had the first a draw. The rematch was clear for Mayweather.

 

Didn't look very impressive in the rematch, either. Clear win, but a very timid performance.

The point stands, there is no earthly way he's "toying" with a prime Chavez.

 

I never said there was, in fact I said right off the bat that Floyd doesn't toy with him, definitely not imo.

I was only talking about you saying that he had much trouble with Castillo. He only did in one of their bouts. And I think you're wrong to discredit his performance in the rematch. 'Timid' you may call it, but what it definitely was was Mayweather winning a wide decision over Castillo, who was the top lightweight of that particular era. There is no set way to win a fight, it's subjective, and Floyd did it well in that fight.

 

I wasn't responding to you in the first place. You're the one who responded to me.

I said he struggled mightily with him, and that he did.

I had it about 8-4, and given the fact that he had two good hands in this one (as it was made such a big deal of in the first fight), I'd have expected more on the offensive end.

Sure. He won the rematch clean. I don't think his performance in either bodes well in a fight against Castillo's clear superior, and that was the point of my original post.

 

I truly believe its a consequence of how he ended his career.

Roy Jones star is fading for much of the general boxing public, too.

Memories are important, and the recent ones are stronger than us historically oriented fans like to think they are.

Ending your career getting the tar kicked out of you by the new heroes of boxing is not going to do you an amazing amount of good if you want to be remembered as a GOAT at all times.

Its a shame, he was utterly amazing at his peak.

 

I never disputed anything to do with Chavez! I was calling you out on being subjective as opposed to objective. You said that he struggled mightily with Castillo, so I played Devils advocate by pointing out that that only tells half of the story, because they fought twice and he only struggled with him once.

That's all I was doing, please don't put some other type of words in my mouth.