Just how good was Vernon Forrest?

It's getting too easy to become side-tracked around here.:yep

Yeah, it's unfortunate his resume is so lacking in depth as he was clearly a very good fighter. His jab was a ramrod one, one that could be used offensively and defensively, to keep guys off of him or to set up shots when he was going after them. I'm not sure what happened with Mayorga, Forrest seems like one of those fighters that just couldn't seem to handle shots coming at him that awkwardly. The way Ricardo fired those shots wildly over the top really appeared to catch Vernon off-guard and he didn't seem to be able to adjust to it.

 

Forrest, despite being a big Welter who knew how to use his range, could be hit from both sides by hooks. He seemed pretty stern though IMO, he was fairly smart and educated with his punch selection. He whipped in singles and combinations fast and with aplomb, he is a much better fighter than his resume attests to, although as I say I think he lost some spirit after his two fights with Mayorga. He was still a formidable fighter right until the end, though his opposition had slipped considerably at 154. At Welter he was a beast.

Forrests jab is wonderful though, he shoots it so straight to head, body, chest, he would hit you with it. Such variety, and knew how to get his offence off. He wasn't a massive puncher IMO, though he had a dig (which Shane could most certainly attest to.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jzzYlMfkbJ4&feature=BFa&list=PL520A5A1B1BBC4DEA&index=2[/ame]

At 6:06, watch how deceptive Forrests right hand is, it appears choppy, but has real clout behind it. True to his name 'The Viper' he whips in a stinging shot with real sting behind it; then taggng Mosley with a swift right uppercut, which he threw very well IMO. The follow-up combination at 6:15, again demonstrating his potent uppercut, is just breathtaking, especially considering Shanes stature at the time! Mosley isn't quite Evander Holyfield or Matthew Saad Muhammad, though his attempts to fight back add even more to that round. I'd only ever seen Forrest against Mayorga (both fights) and Mora (both fights) before getting some Mosley DVDs, I was astounded!

I guess Mayorga was supposed to be a fight where he could have a tear up and win impressively before going on to super fights afterward. Losing his confidence a bit, and his marketability didn't help any possible resurgance.

Though totally different stylistically, Forrest reminds me a bit of Don Curry. On a seemingly unstoppable reign before they lose to someone they were supposed to beat and never quite get it back. Both brilliantly talented.

 

I scored it a few months back and had it 115-113 Mayorga. It's a fight that I would find really hard to score in Forrest's favour. He just didn't do enough, and couldn't deal with Mayorga's agression. Mayorga won 4 of the first 6 on my card, and that was giving Forrest the benefit of the doubt in both rounds that he won. I wouldn't argue with giving the fourth to Mayorga (I gave it to Forrest), at all.

He just couldn't sustain any sort of rythm or attack. Mayorga's wild swings and agressive rushes were simply something that Forrest could not deal with. It is the worst I have ever seen Vernon's jab. Ever. It played a tiny role in that fight. Shame aswell, because Mayorga looked spent in the second half of the fight (Didn't prepare properly IMO, thought he's blowout Forrest again). His attacks more much more infrequent. Yet he was still grabbing rounds.

Dissapointing performance by Vernon, seemed off his rythm and wasn't throwing enough. Close but clear win for EL Matador!

 

Good Amateur as well. Beat Mosley in U.S Trials IIRC.

 

Good when he was in a rhythm, especially against certain styles. But then again he had holes in his armory and could be blown out of sync, quite clearly.

 

He really tried to impose his jab early but it just tired him out. He tried to get off his combinations but could only set 'em up. He just seemed to have lost his sharpness. Maybe he was already struggling with the weight? He also seemed to develop what we now know to be Dirrell-itis. I watched it again recently, my mate at work reckons Mayorga was lucky to get the decision, I had him winning it close and clear for pretty much all of the reasons you state.

Let's not take anything away from Mayorga. He was an awkward, durable fighter who had real spite in his punches and was not bothered by Forests frame, he made it hard for Vernon to impose his will and range on him, and ate whatever big shots came though and rushed him again. For a fighter who liked to jab, move, re-set, repeat, build a rhythm and then let the combinations go, Mayorgas bumrushes and wild hooks just seemed to stifle him. It happens.

 

Nice one Flea.:good If I'm honest, all knowledge I have from Forrest has come from my vague recollections of watching the Mayorga fight when I was about 13.

 

As always you've summarised in a line what I've rambled on about for an overlong paragraph. Good post :good

 

He broke my heart..........and made me bow down.


Scything.........relentless...........winner.








Good thread.

 

Flea, Vernon or Ike Quartey's jab?

 

Yeah, spot on there. Good analysis :good

 

Athletic slugger ?


Game fighter ?



Athletic slugger ?????????



Not to say he is less or more, just amusing (the term).


Use gunslinger please.......not athletic slugger

 

Tough one. I would say H2H Forrests would be more formidable due to his dimensions. Forrest broke the rhythm of Mosley, who is straight on, but against a fighter with no rhythm in Mayorga found it much harder to get off.

Quartey impressed me with the way he was able to consistently pop his jab at De La Hoya as he popped off shots left right and centre. Quartey was hard to dissuade, the sharpness of Vernons jab would fade as the rounds went by. Forrest was a bit Bob Foster-esque under pressure, and his work became a bit untidy because of this.

 

Am waiting for Slips wisdom here, he really rates Forrest IIRC.

 

Good analysis of Forrest in Mik Silver's book: 'The Arc Of Boxing' if you want to check it out...