Just watched Dempsey vs Carpentier in HD

No because Greb was a hell of a lot more accomplished at the weight, at every weight in fact, than Carpentier ever was. That should be common sense I would think. It would have been a much better win for Dempsey, there is no doubt. But that's a heck of a lot of speculation as well. IF Dempsey fought Greb and IF he won and IF the result had been the same. You've got three big hurdles right there for Dempsey to make before we ever get to that conclusion.

 

Im sorry but a guy who is considered to be this all time great fighter who is found out to have fixed fights and attempted to fix fights cast into question his career, especially when combined with his ridiculous proclivity for trying to win lost causes by DQ. As for Siki, the point isn't whether he won or lost. The fact is that he took the Siki fight for less money than was offered for the more deserving Greb or Tunney. He took that fight knowing full well it was a lesser risk. He attempted to fix the fight and through his manager continued that DURING THE FIGHT right up to the end. Only you would think that doesn't reflect poorly on him. Because lets say Siki actually went on the fix that he had originally agreed to and took a dive and Carpentier won. The title is still frozen with an unworthy, false champion and the gravy train rolls on at the expense of a lot of guys who were far more deserving. Historically we may not have ever known about the house of cards that Carpentier's reputation was built on, certainly not as much and certainly not with the same certainty or admission of Carpentier. So whether you choose to believe it or not yes it reflects very poorly on Carpentier and yes its pathetic that this so called all time great lost a fight to crude unskilled undeserving challenger that he fought only because he had those qualifications and was such a fraud that he still only agreed to that fight if the fix was in. That's some burlesque WWF bull**** right there.

So when I see a guy who lost to the best fighters he faced, often in one sided fashion, who had attempted to bribe some of those fighters, who was investigated for bribing other, who clearly bribed even more, and who admitted to a fix on another occasion, a fighter who when he couldn't win on his own merits repeatedly tried to win by getting his opponents DQd, there is a lot of evidence both circumstantial and otherwise that the man was largely a fraud and that his record and reputation where built on exaggeration, smoke and mirrors, and good old fashioned carnival barking. So when I see someone creaming his pants over the fight and pretending that because he got a good quality copy of it that he suddenly can see how much better both fighters are, well, bull****. Lol. As I said before had Dempsey looked any less dominant (and I submit that even getting hurt like he did was pretty weak on his part) youd have to question him even more than we do. But as it stands the fight went exactly as it was supposed to, literally to the script. Rickard knew Carpentier was no competition, he protected him until the fight came from both other fighters and the press, he had Dempsey carry him for a few rounds to give the fans a fight and to sell the motion pictures and then when Dempsey wanted to he made Carpentier fold up like a cardboard box. Sorry but I just don't see anything there to get excited about. Not anymore than the one sided Holmes-Ali fight, and in fact at least in that fight you had the hope that Ali might actually be able to pull another miracle out of his ass like he had done so many times before. The only miracles Carpentier every pulled came out of his wallet and were paid to the go standing across the ring from him.

 

Gunboat smith who fought then all said Carpentier had the hardest right of. All time thank s

 

Actually he said "he was a good fighter, and a good hitter" and then went on to explain how he got robbed and finished by saying "but im not taking anything away from him, he was a good fighter." He also said at the time that Carpentier quit to avoid getting knocked out after Smith figured him out and started connecting resulting in him dropping Carpentier. If youve got a different quote Ill be here waiting for the source.

 

Tommy Loughran had a lot of good things to say about Carpentier.
I think Carpentier was probably pretty good.

 

Like Reznick, I enjoy watching Dempsey beat up Carpentier.
I like Dempsey's mauling style there.

 

Georges Carpentier got stopped ten times during his career, a high number for an outstanding fighter, let alone a great one or an all-time great.

- Chuck Johnston

 

that's is such a wierd response, you can't actually read what i'm writing through your wierd. dempsey inuced rage. my first sentence in the thread was that 'i think carpentier was pretty ****' then later i wrote 'we agree that the fight was arranged to be fixed and this relfects badly on carpentier' and at no point has anyone talked about 'miracles'. So why the **** are you responding to that with

do you not see that? i wrote that we agree it looks bad and you respond by telling me that i am the only one who thinks it doesn't look bad, what?

you could have had a much greater effect on the thread by making one post with no words and just posting papke beating him up nearly as bad as dempsey did and it will put dempseys vicory over him in context that anyone who is open to honest thinking will be able to see clearly.

That's not even the point anyway, we all know you feel this way, and to tell nobody anything new, and to do it in such an arrogant yet obviously biased way makes you and the other scrooge dull, repetitive and in the way of an actual discussion. If it wasn't for pointing out how over the top and borderline nonsensical the constant repetition from you guys(and to be fair his nonsense is worse than yours, but you're a team atm) is then i would have posted that the first willard kd was my best dempsey clip or about how i watched ross petrolle the other day and, years after seeing it the first time, am still amazed by how ross can be in an exchange then in a blink he's back in his correct boxing position and petrolle mostly just backs off. but no, instead we can't have a mention of dempsey without having to read you two boring pillocks pointlessly trashing a man and saying nothing somebody with boxrec and youtube couldn't work out in a day or two anyway. you don't feel dempsey was all that great, fine, to a lesser extent neither do i, but to not even let a guy say he thought dempsey looked more impressive in better quality without jumping all over him is just sad.

 

Carpentier really did rock Dempsey at one point in round 2.
Pretty impressive punch, and he followed it up well. Dempsey was cool under fire there though and never retreated, just kept pressing forward, he showed good recuperative skills.

I found the fight way more entertaining than the Holmes-Ali fight, so I'm not sure where klompton's coming from mentioning that.
And I'm not taking anything away from Holmes, he was a fiercely-honed warrior in his absolute prime in that 1980 fight.

 

Where Im coming from is that both Holmes and Dempsey were in their primes in those fights and both were fighting men who had absolutely no chance of winning, both fights were pointless shooting fish in a barrel matches. To argue how great Holmes was against a guy who couldn't even throw punches and how great Dempsey was against an overrated media hyped fraud/fop is like applauding a 16 year old pulling the wings off a butterfly as some kind of competitive sporting event. Its ludicrous.

"oooh, ahhhh, lets marvel at greatness as work." LOL

 

My post was in response to these comments below and by extension your previous apologist approach to Carpentier from our last discussion on the subject. In addition to that you poo pood Seamus' comparison to hyped media creations like Lacy which is a perfectly apt comparison. If you were around at the time, Lacy was being matched with canon fodder, many of whom were smaller, aging fighters and he was blasting them out in brutal and dominant fashion for the most part. He had the backing a major network which had invested a great deal in his career and had a vested interest in making guys like him and Jermain Taylor the next superstar. The problem with people like you and Reznick is that you don't have any comprehension that by matching a mediocre fighter with soft opposition you can make him look MILES better than he really is. I don't understand why some people don't get this and buy into the hype because its boxing 101 and as old as the sport. So how exactly is that any different than what Dempsey was doing with Carpentier and how exactly is Reznick any different from the suckers that bought into the Lacy hype when he comes on here and starts pretending that suddenly his eyes are open because he got a decent copy of the fight and can now see all of these things he never noticed before like Dempsey battering the **** out of a totally overmatched opponent and the blood on Carpentiers shorts that has been apparent in the film and photographs for 100 years? Its ridiculous.

Sorry King but when you sign a fight against a weak opponent because you want a soft defense and then fix the fight so you will win no matter what and then come back with the excuse that Siki was so terrified he lost his head, forgot the agreement, and beat the **** out of you, and then you try to win the fight by DQ... Well, its pathetic and yes you just lost a fight that you fixed by your own admission. If you want to pretend that Carpentier was at a disadvantage because the other guy actually started throwing punches well boo hoo. I don't have a whole lot of sympathy. Call me crazy but I kind of like my boxing when both guys have a chance to win and are actually trying...

 

Lacy got schooled by Calzaghe and was never the same again. I'm not sure I'd characterize his supporters as suckers necessarily. I don't think many people were certain that Calzaghe would do such a job on him.
Obviously fighters get hyped, and they get found out. Yes, you can say that happened to Lacy to some extent, but to be fair to Calzaghe, Lacy was a worthy and promising fighter at the time.

Dempsey thrashed big Fulton and big Willard to establish his reputation.
He was already considered a monster before stepping in the ring with small Carpentier.