Kellerman Says Pac Is Top 10 ATG; Ranks Higher Than Floyd...

I don't need to address it. Kellerman is one man who was overruled by his peers. A group of his fellow journalist and co-workers>His lone opinion.

 

Yeah ok too bad for you, your opinion is irrelevant but what they say will be recorded in history.
It's no different than when I was at the barbershop last week and I was debating with a guy in there about Jordan or Lebron James who was greater. He argued James I said Jordan, neither of our opinion mattered in the grand scheme of things. The consensus around the world and with websites and media is Jordan is greater and that's what matters.

 

My Favourite analysts are Paulie, Kellerman, Bradley and Bellew. Is there stuff I disagree with them on? Of course. However i find myself agreeing with them much more than the others.

 

That's basically the exact opposite of any intellectual discussion. You dont just dismiss a mans educated opinion without explaining why hes wrong.

I went to college. Got a degree. When I was working on an assignment I didnt iust gather a source and quote that source as fact. If I did I would receive an F for that assignment.

 

What do you want me to specifically address about what kellerman said?

 

Over time I've come to learn there is a prevailing tendency among Mayweather and Pacquiao fans to be so blinded by their personal bias that to acknowledge the accomplishments of the boxer they like the least is beyond their ability, resulting in the type of petty insults which illustrate you are dealing with a volatile and emotionally insecure individual.

How difficult is it to simply appreciate what both men have achieved in their respective careers and then engage in a productive debste through actually citing some evidence for your claims instead of throwing your toys out of the pram when someone makes a point which challenges your preconceived narrative (GGG fans, Wilder fans and Mayweather fans seem to be the most common perpetrators when it comes to this.)

As for me I tend to agree with Kellerman's analysis for reasons already mentioned in this thread and not least because Pacquiao became an eight division world champion.

 

It's all just personal opinion. You can argue til the cows come home, it won't make a difference. It's subjective, too many variables & intangibles, over all its just a consensus at best! Nothing more..

Stop arguing over some annoying American TV commentators silly list of numbers...

Great fighters are great fighter's! They don't need a ****ing stupid magazine editors number next to their names to legitimize them!

 

He said Pacquiao is a greater pound for pound fighter than Mayweather is. His reasoning is Pacquiao ascended through the weights and won a bunch of titles. And then knocked out Miguel Cotto. He was a former Flyweight Champion who held his own at Welterweight. And that hasnt been done until Pacquiao did it.

Kellerman said that Mayweather H2H is better than Pacquiao. He says that and admits that. And you know what? I actually agree with him. Mayweather defeated a past prime Pacquiao. And he would probably even beat a prime version of Pacquiao. Also, Mayweather would be favored over everybody Pacquiao fought. But he may have serious problems against a prime DLH, but Pac fought a shot version anyways. And Morales could pose problems as well. But that makes Mayweather better H2H. Pacquiao spent the majority of his career fighting men smaller than Mayweather because hes a noticeably smaller man than Mayweather is. Kellerman already said Mayweather is better H2H. You and many others have said it repeatedly for years.

And to be honest, I'm on record here on this board before they even fought that the fight was 5 years too late. I said that BEFORE the fight. But I'll also go on record and say Mayweather probably beats PRIME Manny anyways. Regardless, Mayweather beat a past prime Pacquiao. But what I'm really concerned about for Mayweathers sake is why was Pacquiao even competitive? Why did he win 4 rounds on 2 judges scorecards? Why did he rock Mayweather twice? Why didnt Mayweather just clobber Pacquiao? Why was Pacquiao not nearly shutout? Why wasnt Floyd hammering him? Hes clearly the bigger man.

Being better H2H and being better pound for pound are two different things. RJJ for example would beat Mayweather so bad he would end up in the hospital. He would pummel his ass all over the ring. Maywather started at 130 and RJJ started at 160. RJJ should destroy him. Now who is the better p4p fighter? That's a completely different question.

So not only did Pacquiao win a bunch of titles over guys like Barrera and Marquez like Kellerman says. I want to know why he was even competitive with guys like Mayweather, Hatton, Cotto, etc.

 

Well it's hard for me to admit it because I like Pacquiao, but I would favor Mayweather over Pacquiao. Even Pac in his prime.

 

Fair post but the problem is when Pac was fighting at these low weights he was already bigger than a lot of these guys he had an amazing ability to cut weight at those low weights. He was naturally bigger than those dudes and he was young he turned pro at 16 or 17.
Also if PBF had only started at 140 and only went to 147 retired undefeated then you could probably argue that Pac was the better P4P fighter but he didn't. While PBF didn't fight in as many weight classes as Pac did he did start at 130 fought to 154 which is 5 weights. That is impressive as well. So he did his fair share of going through weights establishing P4P superiority. One thing that can't be overlooked is Pac did indeed lose and that does effect his ranking. You have 1 guy who went through multiple weight classes undefeated and a H2H win over the other and you have the other who went through more weights but took loses and lost H2H to his rival. That has to count for something and that along with PBF's skill level being better is why people will rank PBF over Pac.

 

PBF was not hurt in that most of those punches didn't even land quit reaching trying to make it out more than it was because it was the only sign of life Pac showed in the entire fight. Going into that fight many posters here stated that Pac looked like the fresher fighter because PBF had a hard time against Maidana in the 1st fight and Pac breezed through Bradley and Algieri. Now all of a sudden you want to say the older fighter was closer to his prime to suit your agenda?

2009 is irrelevant in 2009 Pac was still getting outboxed by JMM and still not able to beat him clearly and still had JMM problems. And now you want us all to believe now all of a sudden he's just gong to run right through PBF? When in 2009 PBF was still prime and would have schooled Pac even worse than he did in 2015 because he still had prime legs and his educated footwork would have taken Pac apart alone. What you fail to realize is that Pac was a more flawed and reckless fighter back in 2009 which would have played right into PBF's hands. The version of PBF who shut out JMM in 2009 would have embarrassed Pac. Stop!

 

Ok, but I'm more concerned about why didnt Pacquiao get absolutely dominated by Mayweather? To the point of total beatdown or never landing anything?

Also Pacquiao as late as 2002 against Julio was only 129 on fight night. He started packing on the mass by increasing calories to fill out into the Featherweight divisions. He was 135 on fight night against Barrera. He was 139 against Morales and lost. Then he went up to 144 for the rematch to Morales and Marquez and I think the extra weight helped him win. Clearly, Pacquiao was bigger than most if not just about any Flyweight. But he still made the weight.

Why was Pacquiao competitive against Cotto? Or Hatton? Or Margarito? Or Mayweather?

Can you imagine Inoue moving up in weight and being competitive with Loma. He would get neutralized. He wouldnt do a single damn thing to Loma.

So why was Pacquiao rocking Mayweather? Why didnt Floyd destroy Pac.

You said Floyd is better than Pac H2H. I agree. So does Kellerman. But the fight shouldn't even be a fight.

 

Floyd struggled with Maidana and should have a loss to Castillo.

Maidana made the mediocre Devon Alexander look like Willie Pep!

I just could never imagine Pacqauio ever struggling with a Marcos Maidana type