Kelly Pavlik boxing hero or boxing bust?

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by Martini643, Jan 16, 2009.


  1. booradley

    booradley Mean People Kick Ass! Full Member

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    There was once a great fighter who the critics said would never be an elite level combatant. He had 3 losses before he ever won a world title, and he lost in his first attempt to become a champion. At age 26, with 4 losses on his resume', he finally captured a title. Later he moved up in weight and lost a fight he should have won. His hand and foot speed was mediocre at best, and he always had trouble with slick boxers. He eventually dominated 3 divisions, and became the first fighter to succesfully defend world titles in 3 divisions. If this story sounds familiar it's because I am talking about Alexis Arguello!

    I think this story illustrates an important point, and the point is this: In the over all scope of a career, one loss to a great opponent means diddly-****
     
  2. unclepaulie

    unclepaulie Run like an antelope! Full Member

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    :yep
     
  3. Marnoff

    Marnoff Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    The bottom line is that Kelly Pavlik proved himself as a very solid fighter pre-Hopkins. That loss need not haunt him to a great extent. He can continue to pick up big wins against most fighters. He lost to a legend who put on a masterclass. He's got lots of time and lots of big fights to redeem himself with. He still beats most people.
     
  4. Hermit

    Hermit Loyal Member banned

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    People keep moaning about if he is "damaged goods". :patsch If this fight had happened at 160 to a fully healthy Kelly, that might be a legit concern. He knows he went up a step too far and was less than 100%. The haters can argue the health issue all they want, but Kelly knows the truth of that situation, they don't. I say he comes back in this fight and possibly raises Lockett's stock a bit. I've watched that fight a few times are really shake my head at the Lockett haters. Lockett took one in the first round that really was the beginning of the end but the man kept coming. Used his wits to stay in it as long as he could.
     
  5. paipper_19

    paipper_19 Member Full Member

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    Now Pavlik is special one fight is thought of as to definitive to ever be very significant in a "Glaringly" apparent world. I've always been amazed at how people can look at a fight an take it for everything "candy bars for sale" to discount everything Pavlik suggests that people saw nothing incredible in Pavlik before WOW! This is more than just for fun than I think sometimes.:rasta
     
  6. Martini643

    Martini643 Well-Known Member Full Member

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    If I took a poll on what???
    First of all, the thread wasn't supposed to be a jab at your boy kelly, it was a question. When someone labels a question with "some of YOU feel this way" and "some of YOU feel another way" doesnt necessarily mean thats what I am thinking. I am a Pavlik fan myself which is why I was asking but the truth of the matter is his performance against Hopkins had nothing to do with his weight, the guy got totally OUTBOXED by his skill, not his weight. He lost to a 43 year old man which brings up the question was it all a fluke or is Pavlik just hyped up because hes white? And it pisses me off when a posters boxing hero loses and gets hostile because they know they just got beat and they are in denial
     
  7. Martini643

    Martini643 Well-Known Member Full Member

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    This is such bull****. One minute, Kelly is struggling to make 160, no one knows how much longer he can possibly do it. Before the fight, he said the added weight would benefit him from not having to worry about forcing himself to make the weight, then he gets his ass handed to him and all of a sudden the reason he lost is because of his weight. The guy is almost 6'3 and built pretty big for his size, an added 7 pounds wouldn't have supposedly "killed him" like a lot of you are trying to say it did.
     
  8. lONGCOUNTED

    lONGCOUNTED I Killed MMA Full Member

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    I disagree to an extent. With Kelly's style and skillset he typically needs to be the bigger man so yes, going up in weight did hurt him because he met a bigger man and a better technician in Bernard Hopkins.

    Give B-Hop credit for coming in as motivated as he did after losing to slappy-joe. He once again proved to everyone that he is an ATG.
     
  9. Hermit

    Hermit Loyal Member banned

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    Please read what I wrote and try again. Your answer says NOTHING to the point I made.
     
  10. Martini643

    Martini643 Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Well thats what we are debating, his skill level. If he NEEDS to be the bigger man to win a fight, then maybe we thought too highly of him. A true champion would find an alternative to win. I do agree that Hopkins put on an amazing performance but its easy to look that good when a fighter is one dimensional
     
  11. Martini643

    Martini643 Well-Known Member Full Member

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    what was your point?
     
  12. lONGCOUNTED

    lONGCOUNTED I Killed MMA Full Member

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    I dont think he has to be the bigger man as Miranda was a chiseled freak when he fought Kelly. However, he will always struggle, like most fighters, with someone who is bigger and a better technician. There is no shame in going up in weight and losing to Bernard Hopkins. Too many people nowadays act like one loss is the end of your career. Its stupid and its also a huge reason that people protect their ****ing "0". That is why I respect fighters like Pavlik, Cotto, Clottey, Hopkins... These guys WANT to fight the best out there.

    Edit: ****, surely I cant leave Sugar Shane, JMM, Vasquez or Marquez off that list!
     
  13. Hermit

    Hermit Loyal Member banned

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    I guess my point is now you can't read.
     
  14. Martini643

    Martini643 Well-Known Member Full Member

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    I absolutely agree 100% that theres no shame in losing to Hopkins. When Pavlik knocked out Taylor and Miranda,people went crazy with excitement saying that Pavlik could end up fighting at Cruiserweight because he was so powerful and unstoppable. I don't think this is the end for Pavlik at all, I think he is still the same guy as before but I am more aware now that he will have trouble with guys who are technical and can match him with size and power.
     
  15. Martini643

    Martini643 Well-Known Member Full Member

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    what the hell does Pavlik losing to Hopkins have to do with Lockett? :huh