Kelly Pavlik versus James Toney @ 160.

Exactly the point i am making. That if he respected his opponents power, he would fight differently. He made a very stupid mistake by dropping his hands in the first fight, and it almost cost him.

 

My answer is none - Toney by UD. Toney has too hard of a chin to crack, not to mention his defensive skills, in addition to being too crafty for Pavlik.

 

don't be mistaken though, Toney was 50x better of a puncher than Jermain Taylor could ever be. You don't need to hit harder than Taylor to be more effective, although I personally think Toney DID have a much harder punch than Taylor. What made him simply more viscious than Taylor was that every punch was a very subtle counter, he countered you all day and those shots ****in hurt MUCH MORE than any loaded up right hand that Taylor could land! Pavlik won't even know from where he was getting hit by, there is no way on earth that Pavlik makes it to the final bell, he would be a living punching bag for Toney there would be no way Pavlik could make it to the final bell with his senses intact.

 

toney stops him around the 3rd i think

 

Let's wait for two more years and see where Pavlik is going. So far, he is more accomplished than Marvin Hagler at the same age. It is always easy to take an HOF over a fighter who perhaps hasen't even rached his prime yet.

And I wish people would stop referring to the kockdown against Taylor as some kind of evidence how easy it is to beat Pavlik. A fight were a young contender gets up from a knockdown against the recognized champion and goes on to win by brutal KO is not exactly an argument against him. Toney is of course much craftier than Taylor, but also slower. Speed might very well be a more effectve weapon against Pavlik than skill, we will find out when Pavlik has fought a greater variety of fighters. So far, we simply cannot know what works well against Pavlik, because nobody beat him - how can anybody say that fighter X would easily starch Pavlik? He was the underdog against Miranda and bullied the bully. He was the underdog against Taylor, because of the perceived difference in skills and then he held his own when the fight turned into a boxing match. Who knows what he could do against a super - crafty fighter ie Toney? I believe in two years from now, there will be a much more objective basis for an answer.

 

Toney by KO about the 8th round.

 

Toney KO5

He'll not take many shots, even if he does he's not going to respect KP's power one bit, where Pavlik will have no choice but to respect James'. People forget how good Toney really was and a basic well schooled but straight line fighter was/is his bread and butter. He'd ice Pavlik no problems, he's easy to work out, he's a tough, power punching straight liner, but Toney wasn't called Lights Out for no reason. Bad bad style matchup, Pavlik is made for Toney imo.

 

Whom did Hagler figh before he fought for the championship that was stronger than Taylor? Do your really feel the two fighters who Hagler lost to, who had both lost before, were stronger than the undefeated Taylor that Pavlik met?

It is so easy to glorify the old days. Why and how is Pavlik's opposition until now weaker than Hagler's opposition in the first 33 fights? I am not talking about the whole career, Hagler had almost twice as many fights. All I am saying is that at 33 fights, little indicated that Hagler would take it to the level he did.

 

lights out wins via 9rd KO

 

Pavlik is tough, he'll get outboxed all night long but he won't fall until the late rds.

 

Did all of this make you feel better Ams?? Had to dig up one of the true ATG's from 160 to try to discredit a 25 year old guy who's just won his first belt and yet to even make his first defense??

KP= Keep Amsterdam up late at nights!

 

:deal
agree 10% amsterdam, I have been saying this for the longest. Power and length is only gonna take you to a point.
The day Kelly runs into a technically sound boxing, with decent handspeed and power. He is done. But so far he has done what it takes to get his W's for that I applaud him. we dont even need to go as far as james toney.
If he fought Chad Dawson I think he would get starched.

 

definetly around 6 - 10 just due to kelly's determination. I can definetly see a first round KO though. Kelly is very open to the left hooks. Look at his fight wiht Zuniga. He almost got knocked out in the first round. Toney has a monster left hook.

 

Might actually consider DEATH by JAMES TONEY.

 

Toney bwins by Wide UD or KO

Pavlik's style plays right into Toneys hands