Kelly "The overrated Mid-western tomato can" Pavlik...

Stop debating with green plants.

 

It isn't his "debating" green plants that is the problem.
:spliff

 

Let me ask YOU a question, how many boxers have as MANY controversial decisions as J Taylor?

 

HAHA Hermit you are funny man. Be real with yourself, Jtaylor is a good fighter but lets be honest here man, he DOES have a lot of controversial wins, can't we agree on that?

 

No. Since you are relatively new here, let me recap. I stopped following boxing when it went off broadcast TV in the states. Since Kelly is a local he piqued my interest in boxing again, I have tried watching utube, but it is really hard to make an informed judgment on fights because of the poor quality. I have found 'other sources' and I'm catching up a bit. So, in short, I have not seen those "controversial wins" in a format that would allow me to render a decision. Unlike some on this board, I'm not going to just go with the crowd to look more knowledgeable. I know what I know. I really do try and stick to posting on that basis.

Here is the opinion I have formed of Taylor. Steward has had several boxers that seemed to come in under prepared conditioning wise. I think Taylor was essentially through at Middle Weight shortely after winning the Bhope decision. Steward doesn't seem to 'work' the weight off with conditioning. Taylor was fighting drained and under conditioned. Hence the smaller opponents and lackluster performances. He looked much better once he ditched Steward and went to 166 for his second fight with Pavlik. People say Taylor only looked better because Pavlik was sluggish. atsch I like to watch fights back to back frequently when I want to do comparisions.

Taylor did not look 'world beater' against Lacy but he hadn't fougtht for awhile. To me, the jury is still out on Taylor at 168 until we see if his heart is really in this. If it is, he is easily one or two in the division.

quick edit. The scorecards in the first pav/tay contest were jokes. The judges seemed to be the only ones thinking Taylor was winning. Oh. The official HBO website score card had Taylor pitching a shutout. Based on that, I do tend to believe Taylor was getting the 'benefit of the champ' in scoring.

 

Fair asessment Hermit, just because I am new to eastside boxing does not mean I am new to the boxing scene, my first fight I was in attendance was tyson-holyfied 1. I try to keep it respectful, I know we butt heads with the aa-pavlik discussion but that is what this forum is all about.

 

Taylor had two controversial fights. The BHop controversey was settled pretty clearly in the 2nd fight. After the Winky fight JT offered Wright a rematch. When Winky turned it down, that ended the controversey.

 

The first fight between jtaylor hopkins controversial/debateable
the second fight between jtaylor hopkins WAS NOT A CLEAR DECISION
WINKY WRIGHT fight was debatable
COREY SPINKS debatebale


Yes he has been in controversial fights, a I might add a lot of them

 

I dunno bout Kelly..before B-Hop I thought he was pretty good....after seeing him schooled like that I'd like to see him fight another A+ boxer...at 160 Kelly is a different fighter from what he is above that...Kelly vs AA or Sturm could tell me how good he really is...!!

 

I actually had Spinks beating Taylor by a wide Margin and him losing to Hopkins in their first fight, but i still give Kelly a lot of credit though. No one has beaten Jermain as convincingly as him or knocked him out the way he did. Oh and i had the Wright fight a draw, it was even going into the twelfth round but since Winky gave it away, i scored for Jermain.

 

The Pavlik hate right now amazes me. He lost to B-Hop.... big deal. Experience won out, on top of Pavlik clearly not being effective at the higher weight. That doesn't take away Pavlik's great wins over Taylor, and equally exciting knockout over Miranda.

 

No. He's an A fighter who lost to a great one! Pavlik time is just not now but it will come!

 

Right on, but the Pavlik hate has been there WAY before he stepped foot in the ring with Mr. Hopkins, and that fight has given the hater's not only plenty of ammo, but in their minds "proof" that they were right about him.:tired

 

This is correct. The guy is young and just won his first Title, ffs. With only one defense of his title, the market (or what ever) pushed him into climbing 2 weight classes to take on a NO **** MASTER, who happened to have his self proclaimed "best perfomance of his entire life".

Pavlik will get back on track rockin' the teeth out of some Mando's and then he'll be really coming into it.

 

Forgot to mention on your point about Miranda, at the time Kelly fought him, Miranda was basically viewed as Champion Emeritus....A got damned beast, and no body thought Pavlik had a snow ball chance in hell.:yep