Ken Norton vs Max Baer

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by InMemoryofJakeLamotta, Oct 1, 2023.

  1. Glass City Cobra

    Glass City Cobra H2H Burger King Full Member

    Jan 6, 2017
    Not an easy day in the office for Norton, that's for sure. Baer could be sloppy and wild, but so was Shavers. If Baer is serious, in shape, focused, and determined to win, I see him eventually landing one of his nuclear bombs. The question is if he could manage to finish Norton, and I think he would. I don't recall Norton ever getting off the floor to win, and Baer was at least competent enough to target the body.

    Only chance I see for Norton winning is if he can manage to impose his will and keep Baer on the backfoot with his jab, hooks, and continuous pressure. Easier said than done since Baer was so strong and coming forward only gives Baer more opportunities to land a big shot or sucker Norton into a brawl. I think this is simply a bad matchup because Baer had the chin to survive Norton's shots, but not the other way around, and with both guys coming forward Norton eventually runs into something and never recovers.

    Baer by KO or TKO within 6-7 rounds after losing the first few and getting outboxed by Norton.
  2. InMemoryofJakeLamotta

    InMemoryofJakeLamotta I have defeated the great Seamus Full Member

    Sep 21, 2017
    You always give good analysis
  3. ikrasevic

    ikrasevic For the honorable cross and the golden freedom Full Member

    Nov 3, 2021
    Norton's chin is not promising, but I think Norton would manage to outsmart, outbox and knock out any version of Baer, except the best version of Max Baer.
    Baer wins, and that means he wins by knockout.
    Shay Sonya likes this.
  4. Pedro_El_Chef

    Pedro_El_Chef Member Full Member

    Mar 29, 2023
    Braddock beat top contender Tommy Farr in his retirement fight, even if it was a controversial decision.
    He knocked down Louis, made him fight on the backfoot for the majority of the fight and went 8 rounds with what was pretty much a prime Joe Louis.

    Just because Braddock can do something, it doesn't mean Norton can too.
  5. Fergy

    Fergy Walking Dead Full Member

    Jan 8, 2017
    Can't rule out Max s harder shots, cracking Norton's chin.
    Anubis likes this.
  6. RockyJim

    RockyJim Boxing Addict Full Member

    Mar 26, 2005
    Just look at how Norton faired against Big punchers...and Max was one of the biggest...Baer by KO...
  7. Anubis

    Anubis Well-Known Member Full Member

    Jun 14, 2008
    Ken is dead. Vastly inferior chin, one of the slowest starters in HW history, strictly a mid rounds fighter, and Maxie was wildly unpredictable. He was backing into a corner with Comiskey when he abruptly came over with his overhand right in a situation where Foreman would have had no idea what had suddenly knocked him senseless.

    Twice in the outdoor desert heat of Reno on the Fourth of July, the Larruper also went 20 rounds, with Uzcudun and King Levinski. If Norton somehow gets into double digit rounds, he will be lucky to win any of those stanzas before getting taken out.

    Mandingo was miserably overrated because of his physique and two freak occurrences. He fractured Ali's jaw because Muhammad neglected to have an impacted wisdom tooth surgically removed, and because of the wildly anomalous starching of the even slower starting Duane Bobick whose susceptibility to the right had previously been exposed by Teo Stevenson in Munich.

    NOTHING anywhere in Ken's career remotely suggests he could've withstood Max Baer's firepower or outlasted his 20 round desert heat stamina.

    Getting hit by six ounce gloves, only Joe Louis in the Bomber's PEAK career performance, and Lou Nova in the Madcap one's career finale were ever able to put him on the deck. Getting hit by eight to ten ounce gloves, Norton was decked around over a dozen times, and buckled with considerable frequency. A well conditioned and peak Jerry Quarry would've killed him, as would've Mac Foster. Ditto the Bob Foster who Frazier destroyed in late 1970. (Bob was the exact same height and weight as the Jose Luis Garcia who wrecked Ken a few months earlier in 1970 when Norton was 26 and in his physical prime.} With a single seventh round right in their middle bout, Ali knocked him completely silly.

    How about us getting real about what Kenny wasn't and face the fact that he NEVER demonstrated he could even compete with a first rate puncher even remotely in the class of Max Baer when in decent condition. (Even in their rematch, a grossly out of condition Garcia was buckling him, as did an utterly shot JQ just as Johnny LoBiano originally moved in to end it, causing the referee to quickly jump back moments before he did call a halt. During Norton-Middleton, Jerry, early on, exposed the truth to Tom Brookshire and the television audience how deceptive Norton was in terms of how overrated his punching power was and why.}

    In reality, Norton and his management steered clear of any dangerous punchers until they had no choice to take one on for a shot at the title in Caracas, or to salvage his career (Earnie and Gerry}. Ron Lyle would have murdered Ken and Norton knew it.

    Max Baer in brutal fashion. There's NO evidence to the contrary if the Larruper's healthy and motivated. King Levinsky did go the limit twice with him, but then Maxie exposed their true separation by hooking the Kingfish senseless in two rounds when that suicidal idiot provoked Maxie into anger by trying to sucker shot him in the first, then foolishly waved him in to start the second round, all on film. Maxie also showed guts when decisioning Farr over the Championship Distance in their return go, doing something Louis failed to do, decking Tommy in the process. Via knockout or decision, Norton is not winning this one. Kenny has neither the chin, stamina or temperament necessary to win.
  8. Anubis

    Anubis Well-Known Member Full Member

    Jun 14, 2008
    Jimmy was tough as nails. Ken was not.
  9. Anubis

    Anubis Well-Known Member Full Member

    Jun 14, 2008
    Braddock also had two goals in boxing. Win the HW Title and win his last bout. He achieved both and then retired entirely on his own terms despite a multitude of offers after beating Tommy Farr. There are two many reasons why Jimmy was so revered during his lifetime to count. Max Schmeling was the best HW in the world in 1936, but even there, Braddock got no stick in the States for not defending against a German national who Hitler was touting as a member of the master race. (Schmeling refused Adolf's entreaties to divorce Anny Ondra though, which gained the respect of Hitler so completely during the 1930s that Eva Braun complained in her diary about the Nazi leader buying flowers for Ondra, a rare citing of what Braun passingly wrote in her diary.}
    Pedro_El_Chef likes this.
  10. sauhund II

    sauhund II Boxing Addict Full Member

    Nov 8, 2008
    Norton fought Ali to a absolute stand still, fact, journeyman Braddock does not have anything close to that on his more time, Baer looks extremely poor on film, almost comical and that is the reason Louis dismantled him without much also shows how lack luster the talent pool was in the 30's, hello bum of the month, Baer and Galento where so called top fighters in that era , in comparison one trick pony Wilder must be the GOAT then because his resume shids all over those two and he never lost to club fighters or journeyman, his only losses is to the best fighter on the planet.

    Stiff as a board and open as a barn door with wide telegraphed swings with the occasional back hand thrown Baer would be absolute cannon fodder straight out of a time machine vs todays top Heavies.

    I am not hard on old timers, Joe Louis would do well in ANY era, so would Dempsey or Liston.
  11. The Professor

    The Professor Socialist Ring Leader Staff Member

    Sep 29, 2008
    Baer had an iron chin and hit like a mule. Worst kind of opponent for Norton. Despite his many flaws, Baer destroys Norton early like Foreman did.
    Shay Sonya, Anubis and Pedro_El_Chef like this.
  12. sauhund II

    sauhund II Boxing Addict Full Member

    Nov 8, 2008

    Baer has nothing in common with Foreman who actually is a Olympic Gold medalist, knows how to box and won a belt in his 40's and at one time was the best Heavy on the planet, Baer has never ever shown the pure lights out aggression Foreman had in the 70's or was the best Heavy on the planet and he never ever rolled a fighter of Fraziers caliber like Foreman did...................Galento would be lucky to see the second round against Foreman.

    Baer got a absolute beat down when he faced the best of his era, he was never ever in the fight vs Foreman who gave Ali all he could handle until he finally succumbed two thirds into the fight..............iron chin my azz, Baer looked for the soft spot within a handful of rounds.
  13. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

    Feb 15, 2006
    They are very similar stylistically.

    There is no other heavyweight champion from any era, who was more similar to Foreman from a stylistic standpoint, than Max Baer.
    Pedro_El_Chef likes this.
  14. Pedro_El_Chef

    Pedro_El_Chef Member Full Member

    Mar 29, 2023
    Ali does not hit anywhere near close as hard as Baer though. And Norton cannot replicate Braddock's Loughran impression to survive against Baer either.
    He is going to do his best Kenny impression and he is going to end up staring at the ceiling with a man yelling funny numbers at him.
  15. Anubis

    Anubis Well-Known Member Full Member

    Jun 14, 2008
    And again, Ali had Kenny very seriously stunned in their middle bout.