ketchel vs hagler......

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by shommel, Dec 29, 2011.


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  1. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    I think Ketchel had a huge punch, but he may have become over-rated as a puncher recently. He was certainly no Fitzsimmons.
     
    McGrain, Dec 31, 2011
    McGrain, Dec 31, 2011
    #31
  2. Danmann

    Danmann Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Ketchel knocked down Johnson, and ko'd OBrien, the lightheavy champ at time. His loss to papke, which he avenged, was due to sucker punch Papke hit him with during handshake at start of fight.
     
    Danmann, Dec 31, 2011
    Danmann, Dec 31, 2011
    #32
  3. Danmann

    Danmann Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Danmann, Dec 31, 2011
    Danmann, Dec 31, 2011
    #33
  4. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Negative.
     
    McGrain, Jan 1, 2012
    McGrain, Jan 1, 2012
    #34
  5. Surf-Bat

    Surf-Bat Boxing Addict Full Member

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    O'Brien and Ketchel weighed the same.

    The sucker punch story is a myth. It never happened. "Sailed into" means he just ignored the handshake and started fighting (perfectly legal). He didn't land a meaningful or damaging blow until over a minute of fighting had elapsed, plenty of time for Ketchel to get over the surprise of his handshake being ignored.

    He won because he was the better man that day.
     
    Surf-Bat, Jan 1, 2012
    Surf-Bat, Jan 1, 2012
    #35
  6. Surf-Bat

    Surf-Bat Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Surf-Bat, Jan 1, 2012
    Surf-Bat, Jan 1, 2012
    #36
  7. Ketchel

    Ketchel New Member Full Member

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    Yes & No It was a "legal" cheap shot during the customary handshake. It was the custom but not the rule to shake hands during the opening bell. That's why Papke wasn't disqualified and no one made a fuss about it afterwards. But it really doesn't matter if the "Sucker Punch" happened or not because Stan beat Papke like a dog two months later and regained the title.
     
    Ketchel, Jan 1, 2012
    Ketchel, Jan 1, 2012
    #37
  8. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Ketchel sucker punched Papke in their first fight.

    Papke announced before the fight that he wasn't going to shake hands with Ketchel at that point in the fight because of this.

    Papke missed with his first punch.

    The "sucker punch" is a myth. Didn't happen.
     
    McGrain, Jan 1, 2012
    McGrain, Jan 1, 2012
    #38
  9. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    OH NO ! It's contagious!!!!:yikes
     
    mcvey, Jan 1, 2012
    mcvey, Jan 1, 2012
    #39
  10. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Below is a link to the fight report ,from Senya's excellent site.

    http://senya13.blogspot.com/2011/05/1910-05-17-stanley-ketchel-w-ko3-porky.html
     
    mcvey, Jan 1, 2012
    mcvey, Jan 1, 2012
    #40
  11. Surf-Bat

    Surf-Bat Boxing Addict Full Member

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    There is absolutely no primary source evidence even remotely indicating any "cheap shot". Papke hit Ketchel with the damaging blow in about 1 min, 20 seconds of fighting. This is noted by several primary sources and even non-primary sources.
     
    Surf-Bat, Jan 1, 2012
    Surf-Bat, Jan 1, 2012
    #41
  12. Surf-Bat

    Surf-Bat Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Surf-Bat, Jan 1, 2012
    Surf-Bat, Jan 1, 2012
    #42
  13. Surf-Bat

    Surf-Bat Boxing Addict Full Member

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    It's definitely time to put that myth out to pasture
     
    Surf-Bat, Jan 1, 2012
    Surf-Bat, Jan 1, 2012
    #43
  14. Ketchel

    Ketchel New Member Full Member

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    Who says it "never" happened. Did Stanley say it never happened himself or did his camp say so? Which source confirms beyond a reasonable doubt that flats out say it never ever happened?? Just a question is all.

    BTW...I thought you didn't except non-primary sources and only first hand source. Because I got plenty stuff what you'd consider non-primary sources that says the opposite.
     
    Ketchel, Jan 1, 2012
    Ketchel, Jan 1, 2012
    #44
  15. burt bienstock

    burt bienstock Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Damn, look at the size of Ketchel's forearms on your avatar...Not for nothing did the oldtimers rave about Ketchel...
     
    burt bienstock, Jan 1, 2012
    burt bienstock, Jan 1, 2012
    #45
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