Ketchel vs. Langford consensus opinion?

Langford was a great fighter but a lot of people underestimate Ketchel, I think the fight was a close affair with Ketchel landing the meaningfull punches and Langford landing more, it was not an easy fight for either man,Ketchel was fast,could hit hard and Sam was a master boxer and could hit, they called it a draw, a credit to both men and from what I heard and read it was a close fight, Ketchel was the agressor and pressed the action,and when he missed a shot, followed up with another, Sam countered him well and landed some very good shots but did not follow up, Ketchel kept pursuing Sam and was sure he could KO Sam and it seems like Sam felt his power and pace. I would not expect a master boxer like Sam to engage in a slugfest with Stanley. I think the fight is what is was, a close affair declared a draw, a longer distance may have benifited Sam or may not have,seems like none of Langfords punches detered Stanley. Both men were great fighters

 

To answer the poster I think at this stage it is impossible to reach a concensus; there is eneough evidence to support whatever view you have; a win for either man or a draw.
The following is another view from the Stevens Point Daily Journal, April 28.
KETCHEL WHIPS LANGFORD

Michigan Man Wins From Negro in
Sixth Round of Most
Vicious Fight.

Philadelphia. April 2S.—Stanley
Ketchel. champion middleweight of
the world, defeated Sam Langford.
tho negro challenger for the title, in
six viciously fast rounds before the
National Athletic club last night. It
was about a toss-up between the pair
until the final round. The champion
tore into his foe in the sixth round.
hammering Langford all over the ring
and had the negro so busily occupied
that he could do nothing but protect
himself. A couple of healthy body
wallops at the start of the sixth did
the business.

 

They fought, it's what we are talking about.

 

Are there any Black fighters from that era that DON'T claim they took dive, or carried a guy, and time they did not win????

 

Oh well, I guess we'll never really know.

 

I have never heard anyone claim that Jeanette or McVey took a dive, though McVey was known to complain in the ring about rough house tactics

 

A nice even-handed outlook on the fight there, Bummy.

The fight, while generally considered to have favoured Langford's cleaner 'jolts' was and will always remain an unwritten story.

From previous success, Langford was confident of victory in a fight to the end, but it was a mere 6 rounds with the 'Michigan Assassin' who became hell to share a ring with in a long haul.

Ketchel could fight to the bone like few men could. He is famously reported to have been able to fire off killer shots while in a battered and exhausted state. Langford may have been the right man to strip Ketchel of all his layers, but he would of had trouble peeling them all off in a real fight.

 

Jeanettes fights with Johnson were described as choreagraphed ,a couple of times,I dont know if there is any substance to it,likewise several of the black dynamite sagas,but you know this allready,what was real and what wasnt is supposition,I read one account which said Ketchel and Langford agreed to take it easy,another said it was a barn burner,another that Sam fought under wraps in the hopes of getting a title shot,you pays your money etc etc.

 

And in Johnsn's fights with Willard and Ketchel, he claimed knockdown was doublecross (Ketchel fight) and that Willard fight was dive.

Ketchel and Johnson were both beat up by time knockdown occured, plus Johnson floored Ketchel earlier, and had shut one of his eyes. Johnson had welt on facce, and bruised ribs as end approached. But after time passed, he said he was knocked down due to Kethcel double crossing him, and ignorant or biased reporters picked up story with out checking.

 

A lot of them did have to dive or wear the handcuffs to be fair.

It was part of being a black fighter if you wanted to make your way. The press at the time vocaly protested that black fighters were dishonouring the sport by doing this.

 

does anyone know the weights of the two fighters for this fight?

 

No report I saw gave the weights.

 

The report I posted said Langford was the heavier man, but did not list the weights.

 

I didnt mention Johnsons fights with Willard or Ketchel ,I was referring to his bouts with Jeanette ,which I clearly stated.My information comes from Denzil Batchelor ,who saw two of these fights,and Is also alluded to by Randy Roberts in his biography "Papa Jack",
Have you information that positively refutes these rumours from a ringside source ,or are you just flapping your gums?