Larry Holmes - James Toney - Better Chin?

Toney.

But Toney is a fat ageing former middleweight and Larry was ageing natural heavyweight - unfair to Toney to judge their chins against prime Tyson punches.

 

A prime Tyson would have knocked any version of Toney out.Holmes got knocked down a couple of times but displayed a solid enough chin throughout his career and unlike Toney he won most of his big nights.Had Toney stood and traded punches a little more maybe he would have won more fights or maybe he would have been knocked out a couple of times.

 

P4P i'd say probably Toney. Holmes had great powers of recuperation. At his peak he would be very very hard for any heavyweight in history to stop.

 

Toney was hurt badly against Reggie Johnson not known as a big puncher early in his career at middleweight. Surprisingly he was not hurt much at the higher weights. Still Toney like Holmes rarely took a clean shot.

Id say overall both had really good chins. Toney would not have survived the shot that Tyson landed on Holmes either. I dont even think he would have gotten up like Larry did that was a tremendous shot.

 

Toney shouldn't be expected to either. A very durable Michael Spinks, a much bigger natural size than Toney didn't handle Tyson's blows real well, and nor did numerous reasonably durable heavies. A guy like Berbick could take a fine punch among others.

 

Toney. Simples.

 

Not IMO.Toney had the far more adequate defence.

Not entirely simple. But I agree on the basis of 'P4P' chin.

I also think comparing his chin to how he'd fare against prime Tyson is one of the stupidest things I've ever heard as well, he'd get sparked even quicker than Larry!

 

Toney had a better chin then Holmes (not that Larry's wasn't good, but JT's is ATG status). You can look at it anyway you want. But it's simple. Not the hardest thing to dissect.

Agree. The Tyson thing is BS. I didn't even look at that.

 

Yeah, agree, but I was just saying there are a coupla' things to take into account. :good

 

Pound for pound, it's Toney, but in an absolute sense, Holmes takes a better shot. And yes, the late 80's Tyson would've TKO'd Toney. Just because it hasn't happened, doesn't mean it won't. Peter had Toney hurt several times in both fights; I don't see the Nigerian hurting good old Larry, unless he finds a semi-lucky Snipes-esque punch. Holmes took unbelievable punishment before finally being KO'd by Tyson, he has nothing to be ashamed of.

 

P4P Toney.

And like people have already been saying, its unfair to bring up a past it Holmes v a prime Tyson in regards to Larrys Chin, Mike in his prime would have got a HW version of Toney out of there quicker.

 

So here is the question I have for all picking Toney as hving the better chin. Who did toney fight who had the same level (p4p) punching power as Ernie Shavers? In fight number two Holmes got nailed by arguably the hardest puncher in history...and he got hit as clean as possible...and HE GOT UP. Toney didnt fight the Ernie Shavers of his weight classes. (I.e. Julian Jackson). P4p did anyone toney fought hit as hard as norton or weaver or Cooney? (like it or not Cooney could punch) Holmes took clean shots from these guys as well. I believe the quality of opposition make a BIG difference. Holmes got blasted by some big time punchers p4p much bigger punchers that ones Toney faced.

 

Which do you want, Az? P4P, there's no way I'm not picking James. At heavyweight, well...how tested is James' chin at heavyweight? He fought one real puncher there, and that wasn't exactly a sharp puncher, at that. For the purposes of this conversation, I suppose it's only fair to add the CW division too, and Jhirov and Lebedev can hit and James was so screwed with Leb and still didn't get stopped, way, way, way, way past his best. Holmes fought some big hitters, and Cooney and Shavers at whatever weight might be the biggest hitter either has fought and not lost to. :think Still, James' is so rarely hurt and I've seen Holmes' getting his bell rung pretty good quite a few times and had to rely on some real grit and powers of recovery to get out of it. Either way, anyone arguing for Tyson not being able to hurt Toney is...why bother with them?