Larry Holmes Vs. Smokin Joe

Renaldo Snipes was mis-handled just like Leon Stinks was....... Both Snipes and Stinks were thrown to the wolves early on before actually perfecting their trade......

Renaldo Snipes was game in 1981, but not technically sound or polished...... BUT!! Snipes may have done rather well against a banger like WBA champ Mike Weaver in 1981 or '82.... Snipes was sloppy and crude early on, however, he was hungry in '81......

MR.BILL

 

Joe wins...pressure..pressure...pressure....oh,...and that BRUTAL left hook...

 

Snipes is not one bit a Joe Frazier swarmer type fighter. He's taller with a longer reach and his herky jerky wild pressure has little semblance to Frazier. Frazier's pressure is infinitely more intense and effective. Snipes is closer to Aaron Pryor than Joe Frazier.

He fought hard and had his 15 seconds of fame vs a Holmes looking past him but would in no way shape or form pose half the threat a Frazier would.

Yes but Holmes never faced a left hook anything like Frazier's. Just because Holmes showed looseness vs even average level right crosses at times doesn't mean a great left hooker couldn't have some success against him. Frazier would shorten the distance much much better than any of Holmes other opponents did and you would therefore see the left hook showing some effectiveness.

Not at all. You make Frazier sound like some C grade palooka :roll:

Frazier would actually get under the Holmes jab better than anyone. Both would share success, Holmes would have fine moments jabbing and crossing at distance and Frazier would have moments in close hooking. This is certain.

 

Man you've missed some serious chins here, but i'll leave it up to others to point out your oversights.

 

I always get hung for leaving out George Chuvalo; not that he was ever champ...... Same goes for Texas Cobb, as well....... And I'm not sold on Jack Dempsey's chin at all...... Dempsey was rugged, but his chin was hittable and dentable...... Holy's chin is / was great...

And why do so many people forget that Ali had an easy time with Joe Frazier in the '74 rematch? Ali boxed Frazier all fight long in 1974.... I thought Ali was well tuned and in great shape for that fight....

I'm sorry, but I just see Joe Frazier beating Larry Holmes in a 15 rounder..... I just can't....... Holmes was a far superior technician compared to Joe Frazier.... Joe Frazier never had much success against really big heavies.... Larry Holmes was not huge, but he was a big heavyweight compared to Frazier's victims like "Bonavena, Foster, Quarry & Ellis.":bbb

MR.BILL

 

Foreman was amazing against Frazier in 1973 and executed the perfect plan to destroy Frazier, with a little help from Mercante, keeping him on the outside. Frazier came into this fight at 214 lbs, nearly 10 pounds heavier than this prime weight, underestimated Foreman's atheletic ability as an olympic gold medalist himself and got his knocked out in the process.

Pre-FOTC Joe Frazier wouldn't get knocked out by Foreman in two rounds and probably gives Big George a rough, tough fight.

 

Holmes appears to hold all the stylistic aces being a more technically-sound boxer than Ali, but even without all the flaws that Frazier was able to capitalize on I hedge a little. It's true Holmes wasn't very susceptible to hooks; he moved comparatively well; and was, clearly, in my mind, one of the better champions ever in heavyweight boxing. If boxing were an exact science, I'd go for Larry barring some sort of injury or fluke. Then again, something must be said of Smokin' Joe's relentless pressure. I just can't ignore it.

This is a decision win either way. My gut says Joe Frazier.

 

Stylistically is alot like Ali-Frazier. But with one big difference. Holmes doesn't have the rock hard jaw of Ali. & Ali was hurt on a few occasions by Frazier. In a tough bruising fight, Holmes possibly going down once or twice would be the difference in a close decision.

 

His is not that far off if there even is a difference. Ali was floored once by Smokin' Joe. Do you think Holmes will suffer more than one against him?

I don't think knockdowns will be a significant factor in this match. It'll be workrate vs 1-2's.

 

Larry Holmes' PRIME-TIME chin was "A" plus........... I discount what happened to Holmes in '88 against Mike Tyson............... Larry Holmes was soft at 227 pounds and rusty at age 38 in 1988........ Tyson was on fire in 1988........

MR.BILL

 

I feel Larry would dec. joe. this would be a good war, with Larry winning.:happy

 

Do you mean Ali had the best chin of all-time amongst all heavyweights, or just of all heavyweight champions? I think Chuvalo, Cobb, Mercer, etc had better chins than did Ali

 

I agree totally. I think Frazier would be much harder for Holmes to hit consistently than many people think. I see Holmes getting off to a fast start - probably shutting Joe out for the first 3-4 rounds, but Joe would eventually get closer enough to start doing heavy damage. I just can't see Holmes, who I don't think was as physically tough or durable as Ali, taking Frazier's best shots without wilting.

 

Holmes, at least the younger version, never struck me as being a rather durable or tough heavyweight. He always looked so skinny and spindly. I watched the Holmes/Prater fight on Youtube the other night - from 1977 - and Holmes was 209lbs and looked like a light heavyweight. My gut just says that Frazier would grind Holmes down and stop him. I know physical strength is not always a determining factor in who wins a fight, but I think in a Frazier/Holmes fight it would be a huge factor.

 

Perhaps.?.? But Ali is still The Greatest!!:heybbb

MR.BILL