Larry Holmes W 15 Carl Williams 1985

Williams was similar to a few eighties contenders...good jab and not much to back it up...and once he had his first defeat he became quite vulnerable...lost confidence and never fulfilled ability and potential. (Biggs..Tubbs...Thomas)...
Yes ive watched it again i think he beat Holmes but not so emphatically that it was a robbery that he didnt get the nod.
Blew his prospects by getting knocked out by Weaver then Tyson did him with a replica punch.
Unlucky v Morrison and a shot version of him almost beat Frank Bruno.
Talented but lacked power and never same after that first defeat.Without genuine power to fall back on a heavyweight has got to be extremely talented to keep winning.

 

I agree with you. Like I said, Holmes had a good jab, but he wasn't out there out-jabbing guys who were known for being good jabbers. And the two jabbers who gave Holmes hell -- Witherspoon and Williams -- never got invited back to the dance.

 

Wholeheartedly agree.

The funny thing with boxing and even hypothetical matchups is how effective nullifying is. I never understood why most people interpret things as 1 guy having to completely take away an opponents advantages. It isn't a meter going from extreme left side to the extreme right.

You don't. Never did. But a guy just has to nullify and it ends up turning into not only a subtraction, but a big subtraction. Because the opponent relies so much on it's effectiveness.

Ironically, that's one of the reasons I like fighters like A Sven Ottke or Calzaghe or Jimmy Young. Their ability to nullify almost everything the opponents had an edge in. Look at Young, On paper, the other guy has all the checkmarks on his side. But they sure did not stay as checkmarks once the fight started.

 

The Truth Williams got robbed.

 

I thought Larry pulled it out in the later rounds. He did not look good in this fight though

 

I thought Larry edged it by a couple points from memory. He almost broke Truth in half with a body shot later in the fight and that took a lot out of Carl.

But this thread inspired me to go rewatch Truth vs. Tommy Morrison. Helluva scrap if you’re looking for something to watch while we all sit inside.

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I had Williams winning the fight. The thing that most impressed me was that he was able to outjab the guy with the best left jab in the heavyweight division. Of course Carl was 10 years younger, was taller and had a longer reach but still an impressive feat. I remember when I watched the fight in 85, I thought he was going to be the future of the division once Holmes retired.

 

RIP to both of these Champs......

 

I agree with this 100%. Nicely put

 

Lol. Pacheco would have had a cow. The fight doctor would have written up a diet plan for Chris while at ringside

 

I recall watching that fight on May 19 1985, live on NBC. Larry Holmes looked spent and his eye was swollen shut, but he kept his IBF title. I actually thought Williams won the title. It was then that I thought that that Larry would lose to Michael Spinks in their upcoming title bout.

 

So young yet so cynical
Or maybe im oldtime fool

 

I just scored this bout on Monday and loaded it onto the scorecard thread. Here is what I wrote:

Today, its the Larry Holmes v Carl 'The Truth' Williams bout. I watched it back in the day and just tabulated it in my head roughly at the time and I felt it was a draw. But now, pen-to-paper, Larry doesn't make out that well.

Round 1: 10-10 Even
Round 2: 10-9 Williams
Round 3: 10-9 Williams
Round 4: 10-10 Even
Round 5: 10-9 Williams
Round 6: 10-9 Williams
Round 7: 10-9 Holmes
Round 8: 10-9 Williams
Round 9: 10-9 Holmes
Round 10: 10-9 Williams
Round 11: 10-9 Williams
Round 12: 10-9 Holmes
Round 13: 10-9 Williams
Round 14: 10-9 Holmes
Round 15: 10-9 Holmes

Total: 145-142 Williams

I'm not one to give points for reputation as Ferdie Pacheco drones on throughout the contest. One has to earn it IMO. Actual scores were 143-142 and 2 scores of 146-139 all for Holmes. There is simply no way anyone could give Holmes that fight on those last two scores. That is 11-4 in rounds, which simply no one with any shred of knowledge or decency could come up with. Holmes was clearly outpointed in this bout, IMO. Moreover, I looked at the two judges who scored the bout lopsidedly for Holmes. And its interesting to note, Paul Gibbs was participating in only his 6th judging assignment and Al Rothenberg I knew as Pernell Whitaker's hand-picked referee that he took with him everywhere. In a nutshell, Williams had a right to feel like he was mugged.

 

144-143 Holmes. Close ass fight.

 

I can't recollect my scoring of the fight, the last time I watched it (roughly 14-15 years ago, now). I do remember having it for Holmes, in the end, with it having gone to the wire; Holmes pulling it out at the 11th hour.

I'd have to watch it again to put some actual numbers on that but, given how close I can recall it being, I might just as easily score it for Williams next time.