Legends in Today's Era

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by The Undefeated Lachbuster, Sep 29, 2018.


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  1. The Undefeated Lachbuster

    The Undefeated Lachbuster On the Italian agenda Full Member

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    Dempsey has fought men much more skilled as well

    Also big man with skills? Well if I haven't heard that argument before...

    As I'll always say

    Big man with skills < normal man with more skills

    Jess Willard would beat David Price
     
    The Undefeated Lachbuster, Sep 30, 2018
    The Undefeated Lachbuster, Sep 30, 2018
    #31
  2. The Undefeated Lachbuster

    The Undefeated Lachbuster On the Italian agenda Full Member

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    Also, on the subject, what's the big man argument anyways? Whats the size argument? Power? Dempsey hits harder than guys like Joshua and Fury (Wilder is debatable). So if dempsey, due to genetics, hits harder than the big man, what else is there? Does being big help with stamina? Speed? Chin? Nope.

    So what even is the big man with skills argument? Once you hit the weight of diminishing returns for power, and you're blessed with genetic power, then there's no point to being a guy like Valuev.
     
    The Undefeated Lachbuster, Sep 30, 2018
    The Undefeated Lachbuster, Sep 30, 2018
    #32
  3. It's Ovah

    It's Ovah I am very feel me good. Full Member

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    Uh huh.
     
    It's Ovah, Sep 30, 2018
    It's Ovah, Sep 30, 2018
    #33
  4. It's Ovah

    It's Ovah I am very feel me good. Full Member

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    There are a ton of other threads debating this if you're still confused.
     
    It's Ovah, Sep 30, 2018
    It's Ovah, Sep 30, 2018
    #34
  5. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Well there's certainly a big differential in power according to the guys who do it. Holyfield and Haye have both spoken about it, Haye likening a heavyweight jab to a cruiserweight right hand.

    For me, it's more like a "wearing" thing than anything else. Getting hit repeatedly and hard for a living is difficult and the bigger the man hitting you, than you, the more wearing I imagine that to be.

    Whether i'm right about this or not is immaterial though. Guys who fought at cw and hw are clear that getting hit by heavies are notably different.
     
    McGrain, Sep 30, 2018
    McGrain, Sep 30, 2018
    #35
  6. The Undefeated Lachbuster

    The Undefeated Lachbuster On the Italian agenda Full Member

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    probably because of all of the crazy weight cutting Cruisers do, which harms their performance. Also, theres no genetic freak of punch power in the CW division like Dempsey or Marciano or even Patterson. It also helps that they fought at their natural weight.

    Think about it, Shavers hit harder than Foreman, Marciano hit harder than Louis and Baer, Dempsey hit harder than Willard, Wills and Louis, Wilder hits harder than AJ and Fury, Lyle hit harder than Shannon Briggs, even Mercer said Morrison hit harder than Lewis.
     
    The Undefeated Lachbuster, Sep 30, 2018
    The Undefeated Lachbuster, Sep 30, 2018
    #36
  7. The Undefeated Lachbuster

    The Undefeated Lachbuster On the Italian agenda Full Member

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    TL;DR: Yes big men on average hit harder, but weight has diminishing returns, and certain genetic freaks can hit harder than guys who outweigh them by alot
     
    The Undefeated Lachbuster, Sep 30, 2018
    The Undefeated Lachbuster, Sep 30, 2018
    #37
  8. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Well, like any other weight division, some will do so, others will be natural at the weight. Neither of the guys I gave examples of were killing themselves, but i'm sure there were others.

    I'm not sure anyone who's been hit by Denis Lebedev would agree with you!

    I'm sure there are a lot of examples.

    But generally speaking, bigger men hit harder.
     
    McGrain, Sep 30, 2018
    McGrain, Sep 30, 2018
    #38
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  9. It's Ovah

    It's Ovah I am very feel me good. Full Member

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    Kudryashov and Gassiev both hit harder than many full blown heavyweights. Arreola is on record as saying Gassiev hit him the hardest out of anybody he fought or sparred. Sounds pretty freak-like to me.
     
    It's Ovah, Oct 6, 2018
    It's Ovah, Oct 6, 2018
    #39
  10. PhillyPhan69

    PhillyPhan69 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Generally speaking the cream always rises to the top. I suspect each of them would find thier way into contention among the cream of today’s crop and battle for supremacy.
     
    PhillyPhan69, Oct 6, 2018
    PhillyPhan69, Oct 6, 2018
    #40
    The Undefeated Lachbuster likes this.
  11. The Malibu Mauler

    The Malibu Mauler Lakers in 5 Full Member

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    I could see any of them as champion now but with different ways. Marciano would be a better Wilder because of his insane power and explosiveness. Louis has beaten intense competition in his day so he wouldn't have too much trouble. Foreman is a powerful beast with an almost unrivaled power (except for Shavers). Fraizer is basically a lite Marciano, but he's still above the current competition. Dempsey is an amazing all-around giant slayer. He woud destroy the competition. Ali would outbox them. Liston was a pretty strong puncher who gave Ali a run for his money. IMO the ease goes
    Marciano
    Dempsey
    Ali
    Louis
    Foreman and Liston, interchangeable
    Frazier
    There are good fighters like AJ, Fury and Wilder (as much as I dislike him) but legends are far above our """superior athetes""" LeBron
     
    The Malibu Mauler, Oct 6, 2018
    The Malibu Mauler, Oct 6, 2018
    #41
    The Undefeated Lachbuster likes this.
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