Lennox Lewis; Greatest Heavyweight of all time?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Lunny, Mar 18, 2009.


  1. Holmes' Jab

    Holmes' Jab Master Jabber Full Member

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    Lewis outboxes Foreman and stops him late. He loses a narrow decision to Holmes. He'd knock Norton out.
     
  2. round15

    round15 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    I've also heard Foreman say that Lewis is the greatest, and I don't agree as well. I do believe Lennox Lewis right now is the greatest of the heavyweight big men in the history of the sport. He's certainly way ahead of Willard, Baer and Carnera.
     
  3. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Lewis is the #1 super-heavy, that's fair to say.
     
  4. MaliSlamusrex

    MaliSlamusrex Boxing Addict Full Member

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    1. Joe Louis - Joe Louis was a natural instinctive boxer.
    2. Lennox Lewis - Lewis was an intelligent boxer who studies the sport and found the best style to dominate the division
    3. Muhammad Ali - a flair boxer who developed styles and set trends, but at times he was sloppy.

    But to be honest i wouldn't mind changing the top 3 i change my mind very often who is no 1-3 but this is my top 3.
     
  5. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

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    You can make a good case for Lewis being no1 Hw of all time, especially H2H where he benefits from nutrition, supplements, fight videos, modern training

    If we go off resume/achievement alone, there is still a case:

    1. Took on the biggest/strongest set of contenders in history - this is unarguable
    2. Took on the biggest punchers in HW history - Tyson, Tua, McCall, Klitschko, Rudduck, Morrison, Bruno
    3. Beat the next top HW in Klitschko at 37
    4. Beat every man he faced
    5. Beat top5 rated fighters year on year from '91-03
    6. Greats like Holyfield and Tyson, aged or not, no one else beat both these men
    7. 1 of the most avoided HWs in history, ducked by Bowe, Tyson, Holyfield, Moorer and Foreman
    8. Reclaimed the HW title past his prime
    9. Following wins put in context:

    Mason when he was top5 and undefeated
    Rudduck when he was top3
    Bruno when he was top5
    Mercer when he was top10
    Morrison when he was top10
    McCall redemption
    Akiwande when he was WBO belt holder
    Golota when he was considered no1 after retiring Bowe
    Briggs when he was
    Holyfield when he was considered no1
    Grant when he was considered the new mesiah
    Tua when he was top5 and considered the new Tyson
    Tyson when he was top3
    Vitali when he was top2 and prime
     
  6. Lunny

    Lunny Guest

    That's far better than the remnants of an argument I put in the OP! Cheers.

    For me the number 1 is Ali still but all those facts you put forward really make you think.
     
  7. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    This is basically a list of the things that Lewis did good. That's fair enough. But do you accept that a similair list based upon Muhammad Ali's acheivments would be better? Or not? Because this is not that comparative, aside from areas where Lewis excells.

    "You could make the case for Lewis being #1, especially head to head."

    What? In spite of the fact that he got beaten by two HW's that probably don't make the top 200 head to head in his prime? How about the fact that he looks like he'll go if you get him on the chin?
     
  8. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Impressive achievements, no doubt, but it still isn't in the league of Ali and Louis.

    Your'e right that he was in the era of the strongest and most powerful HWs, but I wouldn't make to much out of this since Lewis had access to the same nutrition, supplements and training methods that made the fighters in that era so big and strong. And you could spin it differently and say that the HWs in his era had the worst stamina and workrate of any era. They were also comparatively slow in general.
     
  9. la-califa

    la-califa Boxing Addict Full Member

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    The biggest, strongest Heavyweight fighters were clearly in the Seventies. Earnie Shavers, George Foreman, Joe Frazier, Ron Lyle,Oscar Bonavena,George Chuvalo. Ali faced them all & was not stopped once.
     
  10. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

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    I have Ali as 1, I just think a strong case can be made for Lenny
     
  11. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

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    These fighters were nowhere near the size and strength of Vitali, Grant, Rudduck, Golota, Bruno

    Ali and Lennox both fought massive punchers ofcourse
     
  12. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

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    Yes I think only Ali tops this reign personally though, perhaps Joe Louis

    Lennox got beaten when he let his guard down and wasn't focused, the rematches proved that. The Rahman loss was AT ALTITUDE past his prime - ever been to high altitude? Its hard enough going for a jog let alone fighting. Lennox flew in at the last miniute, Rahman prepared at altitude for months. The McCall loss was pre technical prime at the hands of a don King ref and 1 of the biggest punchers in HW history (YES!!!), and Lewis may have survived but he took McCall for granted anyway and the rest of his career shows that

    In terms of Rahman/McCall not being top200 H2H, I'd say that underrates them both, history will remember them more fondly

    So all that aside, H2H Lenny stacks up well, firstly he's obviously the biggest strongest great, he has 1 of the best jabs, he is 1 of the most athletic, hes 1 of the biggest punchers, and hes 1 of the best technically
     
  13. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    I there are plenty of fighters that have a case for being ranked ahead of Lewis, especially if we don't ignore those two losses, but I have no problem with this statement, generally ranking Lewis at 3 or 4.

    I'm sick of hearing this, even if it is partly true. Why isn't focus, intensity, attitude a part of ranking a fighter? These are some of the most important attributes in boxing!! And in spite of what Lewis die-hards think (and I know because I am close to being one), avenging embarrassing defeats is not the same as erasing them.

    My pick for Lewis's single best performance in the ring is Rahman II. I do not accept for one second that Lewis was past his boxing prime when he lost to Rahman.

    As a counter-argument, I do believe Lewis should recieve more credit than he generally does for his longevity.

    Agree with all of this but still

    A - He got beaten by two fighters who are not inside the top 200 head to head whilst in his prime

    B - He looks like if you clock him on his chin he will go.

    Nah, I don't think he has the case for #1 head to head, though his skillset and his considerable (and sustained) head to head ability do contribute to his overall ranking.
     
  14. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

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    1. In terms of length of dominance against the best at the top and proving themself best in the era? Perhaps Johnson too but his title reign was weak, Holmes opposition was weak, the rest weren't fighting enough of the top men or proving themselves the best for long enough

    2. OK but What about Louis's contentious decisions? What about Ali's losses to Frazier and Norton, that some may argue weren't truly elite? What about Ali's arguable gifts? Dempsey's losses, Holmes disputable wins and his destruction against Tyson. Every champ has their indiscretions and poorer performances

    3. He was past his physical prime and the altitude clearly did him in, he may aswell have been 50

    4. A. McCall beat 5champions and 2 ATG top10ers, was he that bad? He's 2-1 against ATGs, better than Frazier :D
    B. Lennox Lewis had an iron chin :D :
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u4SQmxIP5Bk

    5. We'll never know about the H2H, I rate him highly and prime for prime few stand a chance
     
  15. Russell

    Russell Loyal Member Full Member

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    His final fight is actually becoming more impressive with time as Vitali's comeback continues.