Lennox Lewis vs. Chris Byrd.

-Eh? That was never the case, the Johnson star was on the fall. How is that a selective article? The Johnson/Lewis poor ticket sells is a fact and you can find plenty of other articles regarding Lewis avoiding Byrd. How many more articles do you want? I've posted plent on these forums.

-A small number? A vast majority? The burden of proof is on you with those claims. I can point to many writers that suggest Lewis' relutance to face the Southpaw, Byrd. Byrd was seen as an avoided fitgher, Holyfield went on record saying he wanted nothing to do with him.

-There's a big difference between a 36 year old Lewis and a 24 year old Wlad. Speed, speed, and more speed. As well as a double right hand lead.

 

-No. Byrd scored a TKO win. Watch the fight, Vitali kicked the snot out of the air.

-Really, Byrd won the last round and was backing Vitali up.

 

Where did I say he was beating up Vitali? I said he injured him and frustrated him with his head movement. And he was backing Vitali up in the last round, which he won.

It sounds to me like you've convinced yourself with these comments: "Selective Articles" "Vitali beating the snot out of Byrd". "Byrd did not score a TKO" "Johnson being regarded as a dangerous top contender in 2003" ..etc.

 

I meant if I was being harsh to him he was gatekeeper level, as in gatekeeper to the top 5, maybe below that though.

Anyway his resume is sketchy, 2 of those were injured, 1 of them clearly past it. Tua is his landmark win no doubt. But what about the gifts against Golota and Oquendo? What about him being treated like a rag doll against Wlad and Ibeabuchi?

Would he have beat Lewis, Wlad, Vitali in a rematch, Jones Jr, Ruiz, Tyson, Toney, Kirk Johnson, Rahman. I don't think he beats any of them 2000 to 2004

Byrd was a Don King creation, I don't think he was ever top 5 on ability.

 

Revisionist history at work here, he didn't fight Byrd because he was fighting the biggest HW fight in history against Mike Tyson, no one gave 2 shits about Byrd in 2002 or gave him a chance in hell, picking Byrd here doesn't detract from Lewis as you aim to do, it just makes you look foolish.

 

-You don't know what a gatekeeper is. Byrd was in fact a top 5 guy in his time and beat top 5 opponents.

-Two suffered injuries during the fight while swinging at Byrd and missing. Holyfield was past it but still good enough to outbox Rahman and Ruiz in his previous two.

-The topic is refering to 2002 Byrd when he was still near the peak of his abilities. I've addressed Ike and Wlad in regards to this match up.

-That's your opinion, and I think not even giving Byrd a shot against Johnson, Rahman, HW Jones Jr, Toney, and Ruiz is a bit absurd.

-Equally absurd.

 

Educate yourself on the subject, because I will make you look foolish. "Lewis avoiding Byrd to face Tyson" is the revisionism.

The truth:

Byrd/Lewis was supposed to happen after the summer Tyson fight in November.

The IBF allowed Lewis to defend his belt against Tyson under the condition that he began negotiations with his #1 Byrd in September in the hopes of making a winter fight. HBO aleady had a November date set aside for Byrd/Lewis so there was no problem with the network.

Lewis was giving special leway and a fair amount of time to face both men.

That's the same excuse that nobody bought then and only Lewis apologists buy now. You'll find many writers at the time covering this story, suggest Byrd would make Lewis look bad. An ESPN poll picked Byrd over Tyson II, Johnson, and Jones Jr as the opponent they most waned to see Lewis face. Lewis was quick to make a Johnson fight for reportedly less money that nobody was interested in seeing.

Almost get the impression some of you are happy, Byrd didn't get his deserved shot. Byrd beat Tua who was good enough to challenge Lewis as the IBF#1. And Byrd wasted a year of his prime waiting for a match that Lewis agreed to give him, only to trash the belt and declare he would never fight him.

 

Byrd would get KTFO LOL

 

Don King paid Lewis 1million and a Range Rover to vacate the IBF belt, so confident was he in his fighter's ability to beat Lewis. Byrd was happy enough to get a plastic belt and see the million taken out of his wages by Pappa Don. Where's your source Lewis was offered 10 million anyway? I'm guessing you made it up.

The IBF was in bed with Don King, no way should Byrd who'd done nothing since being dominated by Wlad and Tua who'd done nothing since being dominated by Lennox be fighting in an eliminator. It's madness.

Byrd was always a second rater, the TV networks wanted fights with Tyson (rematch), Wlad and later Vitali rematch. No one cared about Byrd and most disliked his spoiling style.

Where was Wlad in your imaginary ESPN Poll? That was the fight in the making before Sanders pole axed him and the fight went up in smoke. Nobody cared about Byrd.

 

We've had this dance before. It likely ended the same way, I provided all the sources you claim are imaginary and you shut up for a few months, than we dance again. Fine, one last time.



-Lewis' lawyer on that exchange:

"This may set the record for the sale of ice in the winter," Burstein said, alluding the fact that Lewis intended all along to relinquish the IBF title.

[url]http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sports/boxing/2002-09-05-lewis-ibf-belt_x.htm[/url]

-Source for the 10 million+ US dollars. That's pounds btw, so you have to convert.

Lewis, 36, plans to make no statement about his future until August. While it is possible he could retire, he is understood to be leaning towards a fight with Byrd, for which the payday could be in excess of £5 million.

[url]http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/othersports/boxing/3030214/Boxing-Tyson-wants-rematch-with-Lewis.html[/url]



-Hyporcritical. What did Johnson do except lose to Ruiz? What did Vitali do but lose to Byrd? What did Tua do to earn his title shot? How about Rahman? Botha? Grant? By beating Tua, Byrd did more than any of these guys.

-Imaginary? I did make one mistake, the irrelevant Johnson wasn't even included in this list. Wlad was likely not included because he just lost to Sanders.

[url]http://a.espncdn.com/boxing/columns/kellerman_max/1526109.html[/url]
The second question asked who Lennox Lewis should fight next. Again, five choices: Chris Byrd, Mike Tyson, Roy Jones, David Tua and Evander Holyfield (I am sure of these choices, because they are still posted on the site as I write this). Again it was a close contest between Byrd and Tyson. Again, Byrd edged Tyson out.
Now, who might be responding to a question on ESPN.com's boxing page? Mainstream sports fans with a passing interest in boxing, or informed, hard-core fight fans? Let's face it, if you're reading this right now, there is a good chance that you are as big a boxing degenerate as I am. And, according to our data here at ESPN, chances are, you believe that Roy Jones and Lennox Lewis should both pick Chris Byrd as their next opponent.

 

Lewis via UD. Here's the thing. Lewis was never great at controlling the temp of a fight. Byrd could have made him look bad at times.

 

Now this I can agree with. I think the best argument made in Lewis' favor is that Byrd would have trouble getting his own shots off. I think he could score to the body but I could also envision Lewis fighting tall and smothering him when he tries.

 

1. I don't think you seem to understand that 'turning down a fight offer' is not the same as considering making an offer to Byrd.
2. £5million is significantly less than 10million dollars and it wasn't an offer it is the amount the network may or may not have paid. If the network doesn't value the fight though they wouldn't offer that money. The network is as much in charge of opponent selection as Lewis.
3. A bit of research I did today showed Lewis was saying 'I'll only fight for £10 million a fight', someone who couldn't draw like Byrd wouldn't offer that.
4. No one offered a fight to Lennox, Byrd's promoter King didn't he preferred to pay Lennox step aside money.
5. For a low drawing none PPV opponent like Johnson or Byrd Lennox likely makes the same standard payday so he's essentially going to see who fights for less.
6. Lewis being paid step aside money essentially is paying Lewis not to fight Byrd.
7. King didn't want Byrd to fight Lewis, he then loses his 'IBF Champion'
8. Those no date on the poll article, but only time the poll would make any sense would be between the Wlad Sanders and Lennox Vitali fights in 2003. It still doesn't make much sense but is 1 random poll. Byrd still wouldn't draw anything like Tyson, which is what Lennox was hoping for, another 20m payday.
9. Lewis was semi retired after Tyson anyway, he'd been talking about retirement since 2000.
10. Nothing hypocritical about it, King bought Byrd his mandatory position as he did for many of his fighters. Can you tell us why the hell Byrd was even fighting for a mandatory position or Tua for that matter?

Byrd beating Tua is not clearly better than the runs those boxers had either, bar Botha who was a homecoming gimme.

HBO was hyping Grant up as the next American HW Champ, not Byrd or Ruiz. Beating Golota is as good as on par with beating Tua

Tua's run before the title was very good, plenty of contender and arguably beat Ibeabuchi. He was probably past his best against Lennox and inactive by the Byrd fight

Rahman has the weakest claim but beat Sanders, he'd go onto beat Tua too only to be robbed.

 

1. Irrelevant argument of semantics.

2. It's over 8 million and says "in excess" The estimates are supposedly how much Lewis stood to make. 10 million seems to be the figure thrown out in the states.

"If I'm such an easy fight than knock me out and make $10 million"-Chris Byrd

3. Considering he was willing to fight Johnson for much less than that, I don't see any reason to value that quote.

4. I've already provided a quote where Lewis' own lawyer said he sold ice in the winter. He had no intention of fighting Byrd.

5. Ok.

6. Make an offer? Byrd and King took Lewis to court to secure a fight with him and won. But once it was clear Lewis wasn't going to honor the agreement, King sped up the inevitable to get the Byrd/Holyfield fight together to make the Dec. 8 date and put his tournament together.

Because the matter is the subject of ongoing litigation, Holyfield will be forced to make his decision fairly quickly as Byrd is entitled to fight for the IBF belt by December 8. "There's no timetable at this minute, but I don't want Chris Byrd to be penalized by having to wait much longer," said IBF attorney Linda Torres. "We have to start moving quickly to get Chris his title shot." Torres added that she planned to confer with IBF president Marian Muhammad after she arrived in Portland, Oregon, where Roy Jones will defend his light heavyweight championship this weekend. Holyfield expressed a preference not to face Byrd during his post-fight interview after defeating Hasim Rahman. However, Holyfield has never been known to shrink from a challenge and he has consistently stated that his goal is to unify the heavyweight titles before he retires. (Fightnews)


[url]http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sports/boxing/2002-09-05-lewis-ibf-belt_x.htm[/url]
Word is Lewis accepted $1 million from King to give up his International Boxing Federation belt because he wanted no part of Byrd, a slippery southpaw capable of making him look clumsy.

This is business as usual in the not-so-credible fight game. Rather than taking on the mandatory IBF challenge, Lewis will sit ringside Saturday night for the title fight on HBO between Byrd and four-time champion

If you believe King, and we’ll leave that to your discretion, the IBF champ gets the winner of John Ruiz-Roy Jones Jr., with the winner of that being sold the promise of a title unification bout against Lewis next summer
Evander Holyfield

[url]http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/inside_game/mike_fish/news/2002/12/10/fish_straight_shooting/[/url]


7. Byrd wasn't the IBF Champion.

8. You said the poll didn't exist. I have shown you existed, so it suddenly becomes irrelevant to you. That's fitting.

9. "As I have recently stated, the world has yet to see the best of Lennox Lewis." Doesn't sound like he was ready to retire and he didn't.

[url]http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/sports/boxing/2002-09-05-lewis-ibf-belt_x.htm[/url]

10. Because they were both regarded as top 10 fighters and were finalists in the IBF tournament. Byrd was RING #2 behind Wlad, who was still taking baby steps. Nobody was more deserving. And its hypocritical when most of Lewis' other opponents weren't coming off as good a win.

-Than Grant did nothing more than Byrd, and I would still argue Tua over Golota.

-Inactive for Byrd? He fought Nicholson 5 months prior and Lewis just 5 months prior to that one. That's regular activity.

-Tua earned the Lewis fight with a win over Obed Sullivan.

-So? Byrd beat Vitali and Tua. That trumps Sanders and losing to Tua.

 

-Vitali was frustrated, hurt, and didn't want to continue. It was a Byrd win and as shown in the video I posted, he was down on the cards but was demonstrating some great boxing and gaining momentum.

-He was probably better than Wlad overall, but Wlad at 24 was better equipped for dealing with Byrd than that version of Lewis. Wlad of today is a better overall fighter but would have struggled more against early 2000s Byrd, because he's slower and not as quick with his right cross.