Leon Spinks was an ATG

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Boxing125, Jul 13, 2015.


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  1. Boxing125

    Boxing125 Active Member Full Member

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    Leon Spinks was a great underrated boxer. His amateur record was Amateur Record: 178-7 with 133 knockouts . He started off his career with a gold medal at light heavyweight in the olympic games in 1976 ( just like Ali did in 1960)

    He started off his professional career with 5 straight victories including 3 one round KOs ( Mike Tyson esque) and then got robbed in a 10 round decision to Scott LeDoux where the decision meant the fight was a draw. He then beat the guy that no one could beat - no not Muhammad Ali - but the forgotten Alfio Righetti. With a record of 27 wins in 27 professional contests Alfio Righetti didn't know the meaning of defeat. Leon Spinks had other ideas and put on a boxing masterclass over 10 rounds to win a unanimous decision. His performance wowed the boxing world. Never had anyone seen such precocious talent in someone so inexperienced. Leon could not be ignored any longer. After 7 unbeaten professional contests Leon, not needing to prove himself against other contenders because he would have obviously outclassed them anyway, got to have a crack at the heavyweight championship against the GOAT - Muhammad Ali.

    Leon trained hard for the fight due to take place in Feb 1978. He was focused - ran with his brother Michael - Butch Lewis guarded his room so he wouldn't sneak off to any discos and he was ready for 15 rounds. Leon then sustained a muscle injury in training meaning he couldn't punch with his right hand so a painkilling injection had to be administered or the fight would have been postponed. Spinks outboxed, outfought and outworked the great Ali on the night even though Leon was fighting through pain. Leon clearly won the fight and showed his durability when Ali knowing he was losing the fight tried to KO Spinks in the last round, but Leon on his greatest night in boxing showed a champions resolve and lasted to the bell. Leon clearly won the fight - winning on a split decision ( nobody knows what fight Art Laurie was watching - he also seemed to think Spinks- LeDoux was a draw).

    Leon had dethroned the GOAT in only his 8th professional contest becoming the undisputed heavyweight champion of the world. Ali's previous two loses had been against Joe Frazier and Ken Norton. Spinks is the only fighter to take away the championship from Ali in the ring and this alone should make him an ATG. This was Ali's 11th defence of his title since beating Foreman in 1974 and only someone with something special was going to take it away from him. Spinks had reached the summit of his career as a professional as it turned out.

    He did nothing but party for the next 6 months - earning the nickname Neon Leon. His preparation for the re-match with Ali consisted of 10 days of training ( this is what his trainer is quoted as saying) but such is the talent of Leon that he was still able to go 15 rounds with Ali and win at least 4 rounds on all 3 scorecards before losing the WBA version of the title. Leon was quoted as saying after the fight ' I wasn't thinking about the fight'!

    Leon then KOd Alfredo Evangelista in 5 rounds again highlighting his greatness. Ali had only beaten Evangelista while champion in 1977 via decision over 15 rounds and Larry Holmes after winning the WBC version beat Evangelista over 7 rounds in 1978. Leon's peak years as a pro were between 1977-1980.

    After Spinks lost to a peak Larry Holmes in a 3rd round TKO it was downhill for Spinks. He wasn't professional enough despite his talent. His lifestyle and age caught up with him. In 1986 his pro record was 17-4-2 despite being Neon Leon much of the time. He was 33 that year and his best boxing days were behind him - so its understandable that he went on a losing streak after this.

    Leon Spinks was he an ATG?
     
    Boxing125, Jul 13, 2015
    Boxing125, Jul 13, 2015
    #1
  2. Seamus

    Seamus Proud Kulak Full Member

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    No, he entered the division when it was at an All Time Not Great level.

    He is luckiest among the "Opportunists", those who grabbed a bauble more by being in the right time and at the right place. Tunney, Braddock, Jones, Jr and his brother Michael.
     
    Seamus, Jul 13, 2015
    Seamus, Jul 13, 2015
    #2
  3. SILVER SKULL 66

    SILVER SKULL 66 Well-Known Member Full Member

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    He was the Buster Douglas of the 70's he had a GREAT night and a few good ones, but lacked the Heart to stay on top..

    I don't think an ATG, no.....:-(
     
    SILVER SKULL 66, Jul 13, 2015
    SILVER SKULL 66, Jul 13, 2015
    #3
  4. Vince Voltage

    Vince Voltage Boxing Addict Full Member

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    I think Leon had the natural talent to have become an ATG --maybe not as a heavy, but as a cruiser-- but he didn't have the discipline or chin.

    If you read the excellent biography of the Spinks brothers that came out last year, you will understand that Leon ****ed his talent away. He was an alcoholic and drug addict from a young age and no one was ever able to get him to slow down and sober up. Apparently the night before the Ali rematch Leon was up all night drinking and then slept for most of the day of the fight. Ali had nothing left by then and a motivated Spinks could've taken him, but Leon was completely in self-destruction mode.

    Leon proved something in 1980 when he knocked out the hulking Bernardo Mercado, but that was probably his last decent victory. The rest of his career was sad, and he suffered the humiliation of being knocked out in one round....by a guy making his pro debut.

    It's too bad, because Spinks had speed, tenacity, heart, and a willingness to throw combinations. But poor training, booze, drugs, general craziness, did him in. His brother had the resolve Leon lacked and became a true ATG.

    So, I can't really consider Leon an ATG. I do think if you matched him head to head against heavyweight champs from the past, a prime, motivated, Leon Spinks would upset a few people that you wouldn't expect. He is not nearly as bad as people make him out to be.
     
    Vince Voltage, Jul 13, 2015
    Vince Voltage, Jul 13, 2015
    #4
  5. Perry

    Perry Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Unlike you I watched Leon from his bouts leading up to the Olympics, his drive to be the gold medal winner during the 76 Olympics and his rise to beat an old shop worn out of shape Ali. No Leon was not an ATG and far from it. His draw with LeDoux showed his shortcomings. If Ali had been in shape he would have easily beaten Leon the first time.
     
    Perry, Jul 13, 2015
    Perry, Jul 13, 2015
    #5
  6. HerolGee

    HerolGee Loyal Member banned Full Member

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    hes just a backdoor HoFer, basically the opportunist kind like ottke, they'd have won nothing without a soft option available.
     
    HerolGee, Jul 14, 2015
    HerolGee, Jul 14, 2015
    #6
  7. Unforgiven

    Unforgiven VIP Member banned Full Member

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    He's underrated.
    He did better against Ali than Jimmy Young and Earnie Shavers did.
    And truth is, Leon probably blew the title up his nose.
     
    Unforgiven, Jul 14, 2015
    Unforgiven, Jul 14, 2015
    #7
  8. Boxing125

    Boxing125 Active Member Full Member

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    If anyone properly reads the OP then maybe you would see that its not serious ( maybe its not North American humor). All its trying to do is argue that Leon was an ATG by highlighting his achievements
     
    Boxing125, Jul 14, 2015
    Boxing125, Jul 14, 2015
    #8
  9. Drew101

    Drew101 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    While I don't think the OP was completely serious, he's got a point...Leon's career is a little more maligned than it needs to be. There are a couple of decent wins on his resume, over and above winning the championship against Ali.
     
    Drew101, Jul 14, 2015
    Drew101, Jul 14, 2015
    #9
  10. red cobra

    red cobra Loyal Member Full Member

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    Spinks got exposed for what he really was vs Coetzee. If the South African had already been a champion, Leon would have never won the title.
     
    red cobra, Jul 14, 2015
    red cobra, Jul 14, 2015
    #10
  11. N_ N___

    N_ N___ Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Add discipline and the cruiserweight division and he could've been. ****py style for a small heavyweight though.
     
    N_ N___, Jul 14, 2015
    N_ N___, Jul 14, 2015
    #11
  12. mr. magoo

    mr. magoo VIP Member Full Member

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    Winning an olympic gold medal then capturing the heavyweight title with only 7 professional fights is an achievement which commands respect for sure. But unfortunately he never kept that momentum going long enough to secure greatness. With more discipline and handlers who managed him a bit more carefully, he probably could have gone on to being at least as good as someone like Ken Norton or perhaps a tad better. But I don't think he was ever destined to make the upper echelon of great heavys. Especially given that he was entering an era of larger men which his size and style did not mesh well with.
     
    mr. magoo, Jul 14, 2015
    mr. magoo, Jul 14, 2015
    #12
  13. BillB

    BillB Well-Known Member Full Member

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    If Floyd Patterson is an ATG (which I've seen here), then Leon Spinks is.
     
    BillB, Jul 14, 2015
    BillB, Jul 14, 2015
    #13
  14. Dubblechin

    Dubblechin Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Um. No.

    Leon had one great night as a pro. Many fighters have one great night.
     
    Dubblechin, Jul 14, 2015
    Dubblechin, Jul 14, 2015
    #14
  15. HerolGee

    HerolGee Loyal Member banned Full Member

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    not when ali was simply hanging onto it too long by gifting a 7 fight green guy a title shot.

    that's NOT winning the title.

    he deserves credit for his Olympic gold and becoming a contender quick, but not for "winning the title". Ali was a ghost of a champion in 77, already succumbing to parkinsonians in all likelihood the way he was shuffling around.

    We should never give credit to former champion s who cheat hanging onto the title by manufacturing weak, fake challengers
     
    HerolGee, Jul 14, 2015
    HerolGee, Jul 14, 2015
    #15
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