LEONARD IS A SKIN CRAWLING SCUMBAG

So your theory is that for months leading up to this fight, Duran, his wife, Freddie Brown, Ray Arcel, members of his team, and all the disinterested reporters and members of the public who saw him at press conferences and watched his workouts were all engaged in a vast conspiracy of bold-faced lies? Duran actually looked awful the week before the fight, when he was dazzling Larry Holmes and hundreds of other onlookers by knocking ranked welterweight sparring partners out the ring? And Leonard and Dundee all went along with it too by not mentioning anything before the fight? And the self-serving excuses that emerged well after the fight are the truth? Ok, fine—I guess we'll just have to agree to disagree about that.

What do you make of the fact that Duran's team had been candid about his weight problems before other fights, including Montreal, where reporters saw him running around in multiple layers, in the summer time, to lose weight the week of the fight?

But whatever you think of his camp, the timeline I put together should be enough to put the "Duran was rushed into a hasty rematch" myth to bed.

 

Yeah, I certainly agree. I like Leonard, but he loves himself way too much.
What he said was embarrassing.

 

The funny thing is it was Duran’s longest layoff in Duran’s career IIRC.

The book on Roberto was always to get him back in the ring as quickly as possible. Now, all of a sudden, it’s ‘he needs a long period of time between fights.’

It’s preposterous to think that Duran would have quit partying and started training way earlier if the fight had been set for six months after it actually took place. More likely he would have gotten further out of shape, partied more and done more damage to his body, and never gotten back to welter again.

And he was going to have to defend that title whether against Ray or someone else. And as we saw in some of his earlier post-Leonard II fights he probably would have shown up dreadfully out of shape and disinterested and gotten upset by some lesser contender.

The timeline clearly shows that he knew plenty far enough ahead of time that he would be fighting a rematch with Leonard, negotiations were underway pretty quickly after the first fight. If he choose to not train (and indications are this part is way overblown — he had camps in update NY and in Miami IIRC that are documented by reporters who were actually at those camps and saw him training and reported on them in real time), that’s simply a weakness of Duran’s that was exploited and would have even exploited by someone somewhere along the way regardless.

 

Nah, Rooster has a different style.

 

Perhaps, whoever the guys is he ain't new to these forums.

 

Leonard is a slave to his own ego. That's why when every boxrec noob checks his record the first thing they see is a red TKO vs Hector Camacho .

 

I think Hagler was a totally different animal than Duran, Benitez or Hearns .. why did he fight Hagler in 86 ? The same detached retina risk existed ? He did it because he saw Hagler faded ... I am a huge Leonard admirer but he was what he was ... the way he teased and tormented many fighters when he was on top speaks of his own demons and limitations as a man .. the same demons that resulted with his getting his ass crushed by Terry Norris and horrifically embarrassed by Camacho cause he couldn't pack it in .. at least Hagler did and we never saw him KO'ed like we did Ray ...

 

There's some truth here.

Leonard kind of pulled that crap on Hagler, trying to reach back to his prime, but old man Hagler made Leonard bite his lip and look sad faced.

 

Op overreaction.

 

Yeah, I’m not seeing the issue with Leonard’s comment like others are. However, my popcorn was good through this thread.

 

Initially he was told after the detached retina he ran the risk of blindness if he fought again.
I'm sure you know that, for a few years after he was boozing and using Cocaine and living that lifestyle. Tried a come back got put on his ass and embarrassed by K Howard . Retired and started living that lifestyle again.
Tell me where you see some grand plan to wait on Hagler to slow down?
He was living the fast life and trying to find away to live with the hand that was given him. Losing his career at the top of his game.
How would you deal with at the pinnacle of your career some Dr tells you if you continue, you run the risk of getting seriously and permanently injured?
Maybe you would be ok with that. Maybe you would be devastated enough to go to the bottle and nose candy. Leonard wasn't sitting around waiting on MAYBE Hagler will slow down enough to fight him.
Wild ass conspiracy theories with absolutely no proof. It's what you want to believe, to justify your dislike Leonard.
Teased and tormented? Who? The only fighter he did that with was Hagler. And he only teased him he didn't torment him.
Yes he should've handled that situation much better without all the fans and media that night.
I've aways said that was a stupid move on his part, I felt that way the night it happened.
But did it stop Hagler from continuing on with his career?
Who lost the most from that move, as far as money and fans are concerned?
Finally I don't know how old you are, but if your young, you will do something you will regret in the future, if your older I'm sure you've done something you've regretted.
Tell me this. Have you forgiven yourself or are you perfect?

 

RIP Marvelous.

 

Would Leonard have come back to fight a 1982 version of Hagler ? I think no way. A huge reason he agreed was because he saw how much Hagler was slipping ... Look who Ray fought in his comebacks ... a faded Hagler, a Donn LaLonde that he made come down to 168 from his title winning weight of 175, a Hearns that was iced by Barkley and who looked terrible against Kitchen and a cherry picked Duran, close to a year 38 year old Duran , cherry picked because of his Barkley upset but still not of super fight quality ... Ray had the power and Ray made the matches because fighting Ray was where the money was at , period ... that said, no way Ray would have fought a 1982 version of Hagler as a comeback fight .. he saw the chinks in Marvin's game and to his credit got in great shape and stole the event ...

 

The fight was going to be made as early as 82. The eye injury is what stopped it from happening. And that caused Leonard to slide into drugs and alcohol.
But believe what you choose. It's your agenda. It's nonsense to think Ray Leonard was afraid to fight Hagler in 82-83 especially after seeing how Hagler struggled with Duran late 83.
And also knowing Hagler struggled with and lost to two stylist early in his career.
Leonard would've known as early 1981 when I 1st heard the fight was a possibility in the future what Hagler's weaknesses were. ( And yes he had weaknesses)
But continue to denigrate and calling Leonard a coward, if that fits your agenda. But the facts are different than your opinion, the time line I've explained multiple times are right in front of those blinder covered eyes of yours.

 

Don't misquote me or put words in my mouth ... I called him neither , just don't idol worship him like you do but saw it all play out live at the time and know the facts.