Lesnar’s Win Opens Up A Whole New Heavyweight Debate

Discussion in 'MMA Forum' started by snakerattle79, Jul 7, 2010.


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  1. snakerattle79

    snakerattle79 Well-Known Member Full Member

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    http://steverattlesnake.cliquezone.com/archives/69


    By Steve Cofield
    Some have called it the best performance of Brock Lesnar’s career and that he’s undoubtedly the No. 1 heavyweight in the world after his victory over Shane Carwin at UFC 116. For others, it only adds fuel to the fire about who’s truly MMA’s No. 1 big man.
    Just after the fight, fellow fighter Josh Thomson started a thread on Facebook.


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    Thomson responded to some of the criticism while looking ahead to Lesnar versus Cain Velasquez. Thomson trains at the same gym in San Jose, American Kickboxing Academy.
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    Bloody Elbow took things to the next level saying it wasn’t impressed with either Lesnar or Carwin.
    I saw something different. I saw a wildly entertaining fight between two guys who are still nowhere near finished products in the cage. To channel Georges St. Pierre for a moment, while I was entertained, I was “not impressed with their performance.”
    We learned a few things about Brock Lesnar tonight. We confirmed what many suspected: Brock Lesnar doesn’t like to get hit. As soon as Carwin touched him, Lesnar did more than cover up. He flat cowered against the cage. He wasn’t hurt as much as terrified.
    ​
    The author Jonathan Snowden alleges that Lesnar was allowed to fight on, in spite getting pounded on the ground in the opening round, because he’s one of the UFC’s cash cows.
    Make no mistake-Carwin had that fight won. Against anyone who isn’t the promotion’s heavyweight champion, that fight gets stopped due to some brutal ground and pound.
    ​
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    He took Carwin to task as well.
    When the fight went to the second round, Carwin was no longer participating. He looked like he was approaching a heart attack and was like a spectator at his own execution. Lesnar took him to the mat with a sloppy tackle and shortly thereafter finished him with an arm triangle. It was hardly a display of technical prowess. Carwin had either checked out mentally or simply couldn’t summon the energy to defend himself.
    ​
    The jury is still out on Lesnar.
    But this fight still leaves tons of lingering questions about what kind of fighter Lesnar will become. He looked helpless against Carwin, scared and desperate. His standup game is still rudimentary. He got tagged with everything and landed almost nothing. If he gets hit by Cain Velasquez, one thing is for certain. We know Cain won’t falter, will never quit that prematurely.
    ​
    This Aussie writer took the opposite approach saying Lesnar is for certain the baddest big man on the planet.
    I tend to side more with Snowden. Lesnar’s stand-up game, especially defensively needs a lot of work. Even Lesnar recognizes that. A smart gameplan, combined with top notch athleticism is what it’ll take to take the champ down.
    We have to see a Carwin-Lesnar rematch down the road. Carwin would be wise to come in a little leaner and also stay trimmer in between fights. If he employs a more patient gameplan, he certainly has the goods to beat Lesnar. So do Velasquez and Junior dos Santos. Any of the elite heavyweight who land a big punch on Lesnar with four ounce gloves can hurt him. The key is outboxing the big guy and staying on the move. Easier said than done, just ask Randy Couture and Frank Mir.
    Lesnar showed great heart but his down moments in the fight also give more than a few guys hope that they can solve the champ’s riddle.


    source: YahooSports
     
    snakerattle79, Jul 7, 2010
    snakerattle79, Jul 7, 2010
    #1
  2. achillesthegreat

    achillesthegreat FORTUNE FAVOURS THE BRAVE Full Member

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    Overeem
    Werdum
    Fedor
    Silva

    Top 10 fighters. SF needs to make the public believe that Courmier, Del Rosario, Lashley and co are worthy contenders.
     
    achillesthegreat, Jul 7, 2010
    achillesthegreat, Jul 7, 2010
    #2
  3. latineg

    latineg user of dude wipes Full Member

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    is that the josh thompson that is hugely muscled and foldz up like a coke can when he getz hit ? not sure but if it is i have a feeling that he's a real TOOL.

    so first of all the fact that the fight could of been STOPPED is IRRELEVENT because if it waz STOPPED nobody would have BELIEVED that brock waz going to win. dont forget you cant tell how hurt a guy is when he is pinned on his back doing nothing getting hammered. if the fight waz STOPPED nobody could of successfully argued that brock could of won. the truth is having a big wrestler rain down punchez on you when your pinned and letting them tire themselvez out WITHOUT getting yourself UNCONCIOUS is a ****ing SKILL.

    brock doesnt like to get hit ? he cowerz ? well therez TWO REASONz why he won the fight right there. i used to box and moved up in competition. got tagged in the 2nd round for the first time ever and felt all confused. first thing that my mind tellz me is to NOT look like im hurt compined with wanting to prove to myself that i waznt hurt. next thing i remember waz smelling saltz and a broken jaw bone that still clickz when i eat. the point being that cowering after youve been tagged to wait for your thinking to come back on line is CRITICAL to surviving and fighting on.

    cain and lesner ?

    ok first of all this "HIS WRESLING LEVEL IS HIGHER THAN BROCKz LEVEL" is so OVER RATED most timez by the average fan. cain and brock would get TORE to bitz on the OLYMPIC or world championship level by the super heavyweightz of the WORLD. im talking multyple fighterz from multple countriez would beat them. in russia alone they wouldnt have a chance against the top 50. that said THOSE guyz do not have a WORRY in the world of getting punched in the face while trying to lock a guy up. the point about CARWINz wrestling dominating brockz wrestling in the FIRST ROUND is IRRELEVENT because BEFORE that happened brock waz CLIPPED and dazed.

    am i a huge brock fan and think he is unbeatable ? **** no i truthfully think that carwin is WAY better than alot of people think. the guy is so big and powerful itz overwelming.

    the brock vs carwin fight came down to ONE THING. in the heat of the moment shane GAMBLED all his ENERGY EGGz that his FISTz would take brock out just like they had EVERY other guy before him. he LOST the gamble so big deal mark it as experience. to say that he isnt in shape is STUPID just get the guy in the best shape in the world to hit a heavy bag as hard as he can for 2 straight minutez and put him in the ring thereafter and watch how weak he lookz. itz like challenging a sprinter to a race after he crosses the finish line and questioning his shape because he's so out of breath.

    personally i dont have a real feeling on the cain vs brock fight but i am really interested to see what happenz. would be great for carwin to take this loss as a learning experience as the guy is a freakin monster.
     
    latineg, Jul 7, 2010
    latineg, Jul 7, 2010
    #3
  4. sugarngold

    sugarngold RIDDUM Full Member

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    Actually Lesnar's win cements his place at the top of the division. His comeback from the beating he took at Carwin's hands showed that it's going to take more than just strong striking to defeat Brock. It's going to take a submission specialist to defeat him. Of course Thompson is shilling for Strikeforce. That's who is paying his bills at the moment.
     
    sugarngold, Jul 7, 2010
    sugarngold, Jul 7, 2010
    #4
  5. achillesthegreat

    achillesthegreat FORTUNE FAVOURS THE BRAVE Full Member

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    no that is james thompson. josh thompson is a top 155 fighter in SF.
     
    achillesthegreat, Jul 7, 2010
    achillesthegreat, Jul 7, 2010
    #5
  6. latineg

    latineg user of dude wipes Full Member

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    my bad i couldnt tell from that tiny picture and me freakin old eyez

    thankz mate :good
     
    latineg, Jul 7, 2010
    latineg, Jul 7, 2010
    #6
  7. Delroc

    Delroc Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Fedor is still the Number 1 HW and i believe he would be favored to win and have the advantage skill/talent/etc wise over any other HW out there.

    off topic but Dos Santos is the next big thing for sure.
     
    Delroc, Jul 7, 2010
    Delroc, Jul 7, 2010
    #7
  8. achillesthegreat

    achillesthegreat FORTUNE FAVOURS THE BRAVE Full Member

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    My rankings would probably look like this

    Lesnar
    Werdum
    Fedor
     
    achillesthegreat, Jul 8, 2010
    achillesthegreat, Jul 8, 2010
    #8
  9. BoxingWM

    BoxingWM Member Full Member

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    Big LOL at Lesnar being No1.
     
    BoxingWM, Jul 8, 2010
    BoxingWM, Jul 8, 2010
    #9
  10. NSFW

    NSFW ESB interacial lovin... Full Member

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    Lesner is a top 10 possibly top 5.
     
    NSFW, Jul 8, 2010
    NSFW, Jul 8, 2010
    #10
  11. james4210

    james4210 Active Member Full Member

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    Interesting original post.

    But i thinks in addition UFC could not afford an other damp squib headline fight. people want more than 5 seconds of entertainment.
     
    james4210, Jul 8, 2010
    james4210, Jul 8, 2010
    #11
  12. monaroCountry

    monaroCountry Guest

    Lesnars win just showcases that the UFC has over hyped fighters.
     
    monaroCountry, Jul 8, 2010
    monaroCountry, Jul 8, 2010
    #12
  13. LHL

    LHL Captain Freedom Full Member

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    How?
     
    LHL, Jul 8, 2010
    LHL, Jul 8, 2010
    #13
  14. Sloth

    Sloth Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Dos Santos is certainly underrated. People better watch out for this guy.
     
    Sloth, Jul 8, 2010
    Sloth, Jul 8, 2010
    #14
  15. Koa

    Koa Boxing Addict Full Member

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    If you disregard belts, like we probably should considering how some guys get a title shot two fights into their career, you would have a hard time ranking Lesnar as #1. Dos Santos would be ranked very high.
     
    Koa, Jul 8, 2010
    Koa, Jul 8, 2010
    #15
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