Lets Say Calzaghe Beats Jones And Retires.

Its a difficult question to answer, but for me, Calzaghe's claim to never having lost, would probably go a long way for me. He held the WBO supermiddle title since Jesus Christ was in diapers, and for the most part, cleaned out his division. Moving up to beat Hopkins ( and perhaps Jones ), doesn't do much for his legacy in my mind. The current lightheavyweight picture is far too washed up to really hold any significance, and while Joe deserved the win it was not terribly decisive or pretty.

 

I agree with Magoo.

He's already accomplished 90% of what he ever will. Hopkin's and Jones are just going to be sparkly names to the uninformed 20 something years down the road.

Pavlik WOULD be huge for him, however.

 

I will ad though, that Calzaghe has never beaten an all time great who had the status of Carlos Zarate, but I'm not sure that I'd rate Gomez above him. There were quite a few contenders that he defended against who's credentials were not spectacular, but tough a comparison nonetheless.

 

Mhm, and regardless of most of them being B-Level, Calzaghe was extremely consistent against them. That's important as well.

Until late in his career, Hopkin's was in a similar position.

 

I agree that this is a tough one to decide, although it was an alpha-bet strap that Calzage had for so long, he did have the air of a real champion long before becoming lineal imo. And he did eventually clean up. I did have Hopkins beating him by 1 point though, i understand it was very close and dont have 2 much of a beef with people judging it the other way.

Gomez was an ATG as we all well know, and has 2 wins over Pintor, an ATG, and Zarate, one of bantam's elites. But them wins are over great fighters who were more proven at a lower weight, not to discredit Gomez, but these points can be taken for debate on this subject.

In my mind, for some reason, i believe Calzage may be the greater fighter, but its strange because h2h in their primes at their best weights, i may have Gomez as the more formidabble proposition for fighters at his weight. That may just be because of the punching power? Anyway, im harping on a bit here, and probably not getting anywhere!

So yes, i agree Mr. Magoo, this is hard to decide!!

 

Good point, when a top tier guy fights a lot of lower level fighters (yet still worthy contenders), and beats them as a fighter of his caliber should do, i give a good amount of credit to that, legacy wise.

 

I agree with Russell, that Kelly Pavlik ( though a dangerous proposition for Calzaghe at this late stage ), would ad much more to Joe's legacy than a probable decision over Roy Jones. Roy has nothing left to offer boxing except shear name recognition, which to the honest fan, means very little once a fighter is years past his best. I also think that fighting the undefeated IBF champion at supermiddleweight might even do some good for Calzaghe, given that this was a title that he previously had dumped.

 

Gomez definitely

 

I agree, i just took this as a given though.

I was thinking Jones might actually be able to do it, but he just doesnt have the llegs anymore, not good against Joe. Pavlik on the other hand, is in his prime.

Think about this though, just for speculation if not anything else. If Pavlik adn Joe fought at 168, and Joe wins, then Pavlik moves back to 160 and domnates for many years, becoming an ATG there. Would people then look back and say Calzage's win over Pavlik was against a great fighter but not at his best weight (in a negative way, sort of how i did with Gomez against Zarate, but respectfully!!)??

 

There's always that possibility. Additionally, there is a good chance that if such a scenario occurred, where Pavlik went on a long term win streak, that some may write off Joe's win over him as a result of Kelly still being a work in progress, and play the green card, not just the weight excuse. I still feel that it would be huge for Calzaghe though. kelly Pavlik is a big fighter for a middleweight, standing something like 6'2" and structurally well built. He is undefeated in a number of fights, and defeated Jermain Taylor convincingly twice. Calzaghe is also past his prime at age 36, so I think people will take that into consideration too.

 

I've seen Pavlik listed at 6'3 on some tales of the tape.

Wouldn't doubt it, honestly.

 

Pavlik's rematch with Jermain Taylor did evoke some curiosity in me. The two agreed to fight each other at 164 Lbs, and frankly Pavlik looked less impressive in beating Taylor at this weight than he did at his usual 159. Things get even more curious when I think about how he'd do against Calzaghe at his master weight of 168, or thereabouts. Could it be, that Pavlik finds himself as having an advantage over smaller fighters, given his larger size dimensions, but his performance deteriorates as he and his opponents get bigger?

Interesting question for future matchups.

 

Yea, good point there. I forgot that Pavlik fought and looked good already once above MW, against Taylor also.

I personally would have to give Joe a good deal of credit if he went and beat Pavlik. Would be a top class win nonetheless imo.