Let's switch Willie Pep and Sweet Pea

Based on the following paragraph, I'd say you simply haven't watch much of Pedroza, if any at all, contrary to what you state.

Actually, those are the only two areas he's "better" in. Pedroza had much smoother, more fluid movement and boxing skills on the whole. Better jab, straight right, punch variety, footwork, etc.

Pedroza is much more varied than Saddler, and poses many more difficulties for Pep, along with the ones that Saddler presented. I think your expectations for the fight are laughably unrealistic, as you probably would come to realize if you let your head do the talking.

It sounds to me like you're describing Sandy Saddler while throwing in Pedroza's opposition, most of which you've not likely seen. Pedroza himself was an excellent mover and slickster on par with many other Panamanian stylists, nothing at all like the awkward, gangly Saddler. Combinations/technical boxing, while difficult for such a one-paced (but effective) fighter in Saddler, were Pedroza's game. You've got the completely wrong impression here.

He has more than enough physical tools. He has the edge in this regard actually, which is primarily why I favor him. A taller, longer fighter with a varied and unorthodox offensive arsenal, a darting jab, and excellent ring movement against a smaller, shorter fighter with all of those attributes?

You're referring to the young, pre-prime Pedroza who lost his first title shot to Zamora? You consider Zamora greater than Olivares? I wouldn't rate him above the likes of La Porte, Lockride, or Lujan.

This doesn't lend much credence to your statement about having seen "plenty of Pedroza". It sounds more like you've heard a comparison or two between Saddler and Pedroza's dirty tactics and made your observations off of that, when the reality is very different.

 

That sounds like Sammy Angott, minus the great punching power in both fists :good

 

Bernard Taylor made Cory Spinks look like Henry Armstrong. He was a runner of almost Lou Bizarro-ean proportions.

Pedroza was content to let Taylor circle the ring aimlessly and didn't try all that often to close the distance on him, figuring that he would be winning rounds simply by not being the one running away, but being in Taylor's hometown that was a little stupid of him.

Even still, he should have been declared the winner in that 'fight' without question.

For mine, Pderoza struggled more with guys willing to brawl with him than anyone else. The likes of Laporte and Lockridge gave him true hell.

 

I feel thats slightly tougher than the era he faced in terms of top names also its a lot tougher in erms of stylistic match ups.

so could i but i think he would beat all of them in trilogies except maybe Arguello

But i wont comment on pedroza as i havent seen enough of him

If you want me to comment on all the fights i will as i know Sweet Pea likes to bring me up on these things

Tough tough fights for Whittaker.

I feel at LW he would establish himslef as top dog but he would have a few losses but i generally feel he would win rematches and be the Number 1 at the weight.

Stepping up to WW i feel hes in a tougher weight and theres alot more qaulity i see him being a decent fighter there but failing to really establish himself. He might win the title but would then lose it quick in the rematch to the champion. He would be a respectable top 10 contender.

However i can see him staying mostly at LW in this sort of scenario

tough era for both of them i think peps FW era is slightly tougher than Peas LW division but Pea is in a much stronger WW division

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The highlighted stuff is absouloutly correct except from maybe the last bit.

In H2H match ups he probably beats all of them but fighting alot like he would have to do he would defintily suffer defeat to at least one of them but i feel he would win the series This making him the top man as you say.

As for Williams he could be out boxed and Pernell could do it i think he would win close decisions that calls for a rematch as they are the 1 and 2 in the LW division.

In all probabilty he would have his hands full at LW and would find it hard to get time to move to LWW and i think it would have gone by the time he could have got it. But i think he might actually win the vacant LWW crown and defend that as the WW division could be abit too tough for him

We both agree he would be a top contender maybe failing to make his mark at the top top elite guys at that weight.

All winnable fights from that lot, i dont see him losing them if im honest. He might lose 1 to Fenech or Naz but he avenges it and shows it was a freak loss.

Theres no doubt in my mind they dont both atleast lose twice

I agree but maybe not clear cut decisions close but clear but not completly one sided.

I agree he beats Sal

i completly agree in H2H Prime for Prime One off matches he beats everyone there but this isnt the question its also how could he do fighting regularly top guys.

a great era in the FWs but i just think the 70s/80s just edges it due to top names and harder stylisic match ups for Pep but the 40s/50s was alot deeper but had less of the great names IMO.

You have said your self boxing aint about power though.

Pep makes up for his lack of power in skills and is arguably more skillful than SRR and is definitly better defencivly.

I agree Arguello is a tough but winnable fight. I think he beats Nelson or Fenech but he could easy lose to them as a freak loss.

Havent saw enough of Pedroza to pass judgement but ill seek out some tapes and pass judgement

I think Pep needs to fight often as he wasnt always the best traner and fighting kept him fit and sharp. Also he would have afew filling in fights obviously. But i see him being like Chavez and fighting so often he becomes a phenomenom and very highly regarded at the time.

 

ery tough era in terms of stylistical mathc ups for Pep

100% agree

I would say Pep wins but its not as one sided as you make out Fenech was pretty good and could maybe actually beat Pep in a freak loss of Peps but i doubt it highly in a top form Pep.

From what i have read and watched of Pedroza i dont think its a wlak in the park for Pep but i havent saw enough to make proper judgement.

Except from the power and jab that sounds like Fenech and Angott wasnt a huge hitter so Fenech is a possible Bogey man for Pep

I must watch some more Pedroza sounds like my type of fighter

spot on like i said above sounds abit like Fenech aswell

Never seen this guy but he sounds exciting.

Is he Johnny Nelson type of fighter?

 

GPater i don't understand what you don't agree with me on on the Whittaker-Williams thing, you actually agreed with me there, saying that he would beat him, but Williams would deserve a rematch. I said they could have a great trilogy, more or less the same thing, i've always said Whittaker beats Williams.

And i think you agreed with me on Pep against the late 1980s and early 1990s featherweights also. I said he could suffer a defeat or possibly 2, but is the greatest of that era, so did you.

 

yes im not disagreeing

sorry if i came across that way

i did half the post in great detail then i had to go help out round the house and when i came back my computer restarted and i went mental and kinda rushed through it abit.

 

Haha, it's okay, i just thought you were disagreeing then agreeing. Sorry about that.

 

I think Pep dominates the FWTs in any era personally, Pea wouldnt have had a chance to take Robinson`s WWT crown tho so right away thats one feat he doesnt match.

 

you getting upset.

no i was agreeing just throwing afew differnet theories out.

 

Yeah, distrought!

 

:rofl:rofl

 

I haven't actually seen Johnny Nelson fight, but if what I hear about him is true, yes, he is that type of fighter. Track star.

 

Sammy Angott. Sammy Angott. Every time Willie Pep gets brought up, you always bring up Sammy Friggin Angott. Unbelievable.

ps Sammy Angott for the last time was a LIGHTWEIGHT, I am strictly speaking FEATHERWEIGHTS. WILLIE PEP WAS A FEATHERWEIGHT, not a lightweight.

 

I really am not in the mood to get in a long discussion about it....but anyone who thinks Fenech and Pedroza belong in the same ring as a Peak Willie Pep, let alone beat him, are being totally unrealistic. Willie Pep is a top 5 ATG h2h for a reason....Pedroza and Fenech, while fabulous fighters are nowhere near a Willie Pep/Sugar Ray Robinson type level fighter. But then again, the man who made those comments also rates Luis Rodriguez over Emile Griffith.