LHW picture between 1916-1926

Its a choppy era, and one in which i dont think the light heavy title yet meant much. All these guys had a run, and most a very successful run, at the heavyweight title. I have to think a bit more on this, but it definitely deserves to be bumped for the likes of Janitor to respond.

 

Wow! Did I miss that debate?? I can't recall. Would love to read that one!

 

Wasn't me. It is either
http://www.boxingforum24.com/showthread.php?t=306428
or
http://boxrec.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=150605

 

I'm not into lhw's, sorry.

 

Levinsky did take over from Dillon around 1916, was near eneough the best until '18 and after that the mantell had really passed on to -take your pick-Greb, Gibbons, Tunney, Norfolk. Carpentier was probably passed his best by the time he "won" it and Siki-while underatted-and Mctigue-Very overrated-were only top 10 men at best. From Berlenbach on it resumed more normal and correct linage. That's my take anyway, I suppose the bottom line is it never mattered much to public or boxers until about 1926/27 except maybe for O'Brien or Fitz.

 

No you are probably as near as it can be got but in reality with so many ND and so many top guys fighting so often and fighting each other they all dropped the odd one here and there. Loughran and Stribling came along around 1924/5 as well while before that circa 1916/7 Billy Miske was operating around 175 as well and better than anybody. Also from 1912-16 Jeff Clarke was more than a match for any light-heavy in the world. So how about Fitz, O'Brien, Burns, Langford, Clarke, Dillon, Levinsky, Miske, Gibbons, Greb, Norfolk, Greb, Tunney, Stribling, Loughran?-not a bad bunch?

 

After Gene Tunney fought as a heavyweight ,I believe the top LH in the mid twenties was Jack Delaney who had everything needed to be a great lightheavyweight. Delaney could, box beautifully and was a great right hand puncher..But like Bob Foster tried to fight the HWs with little success...Delaney holds one of the great distinctions in boxing lore...

 

In 1917 Greb beat both Levinsky (having Levinsky out on his feet in the final round after a knockdown) and Dillon. He beat Miske in 1918 and 1919. He split two fights in 1920 with Gibbons. Fought on even terms with Kid Norfolk in 1921. Dominated Gibbons and Tunney in 1922.

During that same period Gibbons had only two marquee wins at 175: Greb (which was avenged) and Levinsky.

During that same period Miske lost to Greb, Levinsky and Kid Norfolk (twice to each fighter) and those were the biggest fights he had at the weight. I dont see any way anyone can say Miske could ever have been called the best in the division.

During that period Norfolk lost to Clay Turner twice and Gus Christie depending on which source you use. He beat Miske and fought on even terms with Greb though and supposedly was ducked by Gibbons. In fact its pretty safe to say he was being avoided by a lot of fighters which makes it difficult to place him.

Carpentier only had two real fights at light heavy during this period, his knockout of Levinsky and his loss to Siki.

My point is that Greb was at least as good, if not better than anyone in the division until Gene Tunney finally moved ahead of him in the mid 1920s. There were fighters like Gibbons and Norfolk who could fight on even terms with him over a series or on a given night but even they couldnt be said to be "better" or able to defeat him consistently enough to be termed his master.

After Tunney moves up the picture gets muddled again. Delaney was inconsistent. He also had a lot of injuries, and was supposedly being moved by the mob. Berlenbach was being protected and carefully matched.

Loughran had a nice unbeaten streak during this time but it coincides with a drop in his level of competition as Greb dies, Tunney, and Delaney move up in weight, and Berlenbach fades out of existence. He beat Young Stribling who was also in the midst of nice unbeaten streak but Stribling's level of competition at this point was almost abysmal.

Loughran was probably the best for a while but I think the division really slipped after the Greb/Tunney era. Neither ever held the title but while they were in the division Id be willing to bet they would have been a favorite over Berlenbach. Delaney may have been seen as being able to give either a good fight but I dont think he beats either one.