Liston explains the 2nd Ali fight

The "phantom punch" wasn't a phantom--it was actually a pretty good shot--short and crisp. Ali saw an opening and pounced. Even if that fight continued Liston had no chance--Ali was WAY too fast and skilled for Sonny at this point and I think he knew it!!

 

I’ve seen people grin and laugh at funerals … doesn’t mean they wanted the person dead or killed them. My brothers and me once cracked up (fortunately out of site of other people) once when we were pall bearers.

I don’t think you can read a lot into someone’s facial expressions to make factual conclusions.

 

I didn't conclude anything from it. For someone who is famous for being sullen and scary looking, he had a huge smile that lit up his face. It's pretty remarkable the degree to which people on this forum remain interested in him after so many decades. The subject of Liston never seems to go away for long. In a way it's a little strange.

 

It’s because there are still more questions than answers.

 

To some degree I think it’s because there’s a group (similar with Tyson, although the group is larger because more people are around who came up during his career and thus invested in him as ‘their guy’) who figure Liston’s losses don’t really count — they can put an asterisk on them and say ‘well yeah BUT blah blah blah’ — and ignore those in rating him.

But as also noted, there’s an air of mystery. The Ali losses, his age, his death … lot of speculation.

 

Probably.
Liston's tragedy is that even if there was no fix he would still be blamed.

-It was a "phantom punch": Liston saw an easy way out and took a dive.
-It was a real punch: Liston figured out he was up for another beating and took a dive.

There is plenty of blame to pass around for that mess of a fight.
But somehow Ali, Walcott, McDonough and Fleisher just got away almost scott free.
Sadly, It is always Liston the fall guy.

 

A question I always had is why would Ali demand Liston get up and fight if he knew Liston couldn’t and was hurt

The reality is Sonny knew he was in for another beating and felt it easier to get out this way rather than a long sustained beat down

 

Agree 100%! You can tell how much Liston had aged before the fight even started--and Ali was even better than he was in 64'--(more filled out physically yet still lightening fast!) It would have been a LONG TOUGH night for Sonny---much easier to just "take the money and run" so to speak!!

 

Hey Nyterpfan, I see quite a few people making this point but Ali was about 5 lbs lighter in the rematch. He was more shredded which pronounced his musculature and gave an illusion of him being bigger. Instagram fitness models do this all the time.
Of course, Ali did not come lighter for aesthetic reasons.

 

WOW!! Had no idea--great post!! You'd never be able to tell by looking at him in the film of that 2nd Liston fight--Ali's physique definitely looks more pumped! (Which I thought naturally meant he was heavier--so much for that theory LOL!!)