liston vs tyson

Tyson had no defense, no plan, no head movement, little to no training, not even a goddamned cold compress that fight, and he still managed to bomb Douglas out for what seemed a long count late in the fight. That will not be the Tyson showing up to this fight.

 

In a word, BULL****.

 

Yeah I mean I guess you're right, a fighter is a fighter no matter what has, or should I say what hasn't, happened for months leading up to a fight. And Tyson would take Liston lightly like he did Douglas. You right, you right.

 

You're talking to a brick wall.

Tyson was known to be having orgies and clubbing till early morning hours before the Douglas fight, i highly doubt he'd do that against Liston.

Compare that to Tysons training against Spinks. Tyson on purposely used to play tricks on himself by visualising Spinks beating him, this made him train twice as hard

Evander did an interview on this forum a few years back. He said Tyson was the only guy who trained harder than him in the gym

 

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Apparently I am.

Not making excuses for Dynamite. He was begging to lose, spiraling down because of mental weakness, but we can't say that was prime.

 

Going a bit off topic,

No of course not, Tyson himself has always congratulated Buster but always added he should have trained harder and in their face to face interview with Larry Merchant straight after the fight, Tyson literally begged Douglas for a rematch.

I wouldnt call it mental weakness, Tysons problem has always been overconfidence and frustration/lack of patience. He himself said he hadnt trained particularly hard for 3-4 fights prior to Douglas.

that means around the Spinks fight.

That fight only lasted 91 seconds so we couldnt really comment on Tysons conditioning etc

Fast forward to the Bruno fight, Tyson had a 8-9 layoff between Spinks and Bruno, this was his longest at the time. In between then he had the divorce, seperated from Rooney and Cayton, was on anti depressants and other drugs prescribed by Givens because of Tysons 'mental' problems. And of course he had the car accident which some claim was a suicide attempt.

And in the actual fight itself, Bruno actually made it competitive and Tyson even looked away during the staredown.

Ray Leonard commented that the fight was looking more like a streetfight and Tyson seemed to have abandoned his boxing skils.

Bill Cayton said It actually became a competitive fight, when it shouldnt have. Tyson had improved to the point where someone like Bruno would not and should not have been an able foe.

Then we have the Williams fight which lasted about one minute.

So from Spinks to Douglas, Tyson had been in the ring for 7 rounds and not training particularly hard either, by his own admission.

7 Rounds in 2 years will lead to erosion of skills.

Prior to facing Holyfield, Tyson had fought 8 rounds in 5 years. Whereas Foreman in the four years prior to fighting Holyfield, had fought in 25 bouts and approx 80 rounds

Prior to facing Botha (another fight where Tyson looked bad), Tyson had a 2 year layoff, his longest after his prison stint.

Inactivity is a career killer.

 

Isn't being easily frustrated and lack of focus mental weakness? All those sound link problems associated with mental fortitude. We are both barking up the same tree, albeit on different sides haha, cheers.

 

Apologies, my impression of mental weakness was more, 'mentally giving up'

Also Kevin Rooney did touch on this. I did a thread on Ali vs Tyson a few years back and Rooneys comments on the fight were 'If Mike had me in his corner and he had his head screwed on right......'

So i guess you're right, he did have certain mental issues.

And back to the subject at hand, i dont think Liston was mentally that much stronger, but he could be forgiven, he was probably around 40 years old facing the GOAT in his prime when he possibly quit

 

I dont think Tyson has more than an outside punchers chance here. No disrespect to him, I think any great pressure fighter (dempsey, marciano, frazier) would be dead meat if they took on a peak late 1950s Liston. (Assuming no mob influence on Sonny) But specifically, in Tyson vs Liston, I see Liston intimidating Tyson in a major way. Mike was no slouch but Sonny would have him full of doubt before the fight...

Thoughts?