Liston Williams Round 2 Color

I have no doubt Big Cat was a powerful man, very muscular for even today- scary looking dude but his power does not really show up on his resume when he stepped up in class - Omelio Agramonte W10 was KO'd by Jersey Joe Walcott, Bob Baker, Nino Valdes -

Keene Simmons W10 stopped by Marciano and others.

After the Bob Satterfield KO loss in 3rds - BIG Cat W10 twice against Frankie Daniels and Frankie was stopped 6 times prior and 5 times after.

Big Cat did have stoppages over Ernie Terrell 1st fight and Curly Lee was a good win by KO in between KO losses to Sonny Liston.

He also had a ko win over Roger Rischer who Archie Moore got earlier. Billy Daniels also went the full 10 with Big Cat and during the same time period Billy was stopped by Ali - Karl Mildenburger Oscar Bonavena

I'm not saying Big Cat didn't look impressive against Liston he went out on his shield and fired back - I'm just wondering how hard of a puncher he could have been had he put some weight behind his punch. Sometimes it's not lack of power but lack of technique that gets the KO or not.

I remember watching Liston-Williams as a Kid with my father & it was like King Kong vs Godzilla but later on I realised Liston was not the monster I thought he was and Big Cat may not have been Godzilla -

still a great fight and good memory and BIG CAT was a legend but Sonny was the Bad guy we all loved and we were all mad at him for losing to ALI ( we thought he had to take a dive 1st fight and 2nd made it worse because I thought no one could beat Sonny)

I know now just about anyone could be beat by the right style and man is never invincible- sometimes it boils down to will heart and self confidence and a strong mind and heart

Sad when Big Cat fought Ali after being shot multiple times prior went in as a shadow of himself but at least he got a payday and the fame of fighting Ali and Liston

Great video in color

 

“Oh matron!” (As they say in The carry on films)

 

Correct. I remember reading an old newspaper reading a couple weeks back about their fight saying something along the lines of "nobody will fight them so they will fight each other.". Unlike today's era, back then the best actually fought each other!

 

2 Sluggers who weren't club fighters. The entire bout was gr8.

 

Agramonte went the distance twice with Louis,twice with Clarence Henry,with Holman,and Dunlap.
Simmons went the distance with Valdes,Norkus,and Brion.
Frankie Daniels went the distance with Satterfield[2nd fight] ,Mildenberger,Johnson,Baker,Henry,Dunlap,Moore.
Which just illustrates how unreliable and flawed it is to measure a fighters power by his commons results against other opponents.

 

But you are always insisting Louis wasn’t a very good opponent in 1951 because he was so old and only had one arm. Here you are saying lasting the distance with one armed Louis is a good thing because Louis was a still a good fighter. What is it? Are you finally going to accept Joe Louis decked a good fighter with a right hand against Agramante? How many times did Williams deck Agramante? None.

more unusual logic. according to you Simmons is no good losing to Marciano inside the distance whilst at the same time being very good losing on points to Cleveland Williams....

So now it is official. Tonto boosts two former Marciano opponents ...

It isn’t that unreasonable to define the best punchers as the ones who seem to knockout the same guys along the other punchers tend to knockout.

 

Yes I insist that, but Rockistsa's like yourself deny it so which is it, you can't have it both ways!
I never commented on Simmons he was a trial horse and later a sparring partner for Marciano I just pointed out he went the distance with 3 men ranked in the top ten.Nothing illogical about that Mr Devious. Now I've had enough of your posts they always leave me irritable because of their shameless attempts to distort events ,something that is frequently commented on here.

 

Not according to some people, apparently.

 

Choklab states something that was blatantly false in an effort to undermine Liston's oppenents and by extension Liston himself? I don't believe it.

 

Okay lets look at 26 years old Valdes who had stopped his last 3 opponents.Simons went the distance with him.
My point is being stopped by one opponent yet going the distance with another doesn't necessarily reflect on the latters power.
It's like," Rules Make It Interesting ,"using Tillis lasting the distance against 19 fightTyson to disparage Mike.
"Well, the Tillis fight consistently knocks the invincible Mike idea out. Mike showed some of the weaknesses that would later be capitalized upon by Douglas.

Granted, it may have just been an off night, but Tillis really did NOT have the kind of chin to last all those rounds."
Tillis went the distance with Shavers[and beat him] and the distance with Coetzee another banger,the common opponent comparison was discredited years ago!

 

Unfortunately; true.