Lloyd Marshall's Opinion Of Lamotta.

Is the bell footage clear? Will it ever be released to the public to see

 

Make jokes all you want. The black murderers row are rated highly all time at 160. Look at mcgrains list, he had 7 black murderers row members in the top 50 all time at 160

 

I have the 2nd and 3rd Bell fights and transferred them in HD. Ill post screenshots but I wont be releasing them, its not up to me.

 

What I meant was that it is good that you shared it here.
Are you sure that I am the fool?

 

Thank you

What's the biggest difference in Lamotta looking better compared to 1950 films of him? Is it his speed? Defense? Higher workrate?

 

Hes faster, more dynamic, more energetic, more aggressive, more relentless, throws more punches, fights with more fire snd more ferocity. He just looks better. A lot of newspapers were suggesting that he looked like he lost a step before he ever got a title shot and i have to agree. He looks like an arm puncher in his later fights. Even in his prime his punching technique was kind of awkward looking but he was putting a lot more steam on them, like he was trying to hurt guys.

 

These are stills of those films that came from Joey LaMotta:

LaMotta-Bell 2: This is Tommy getting up from a knockdown.
[url]http://i1184.photobucket.com/albums/z335/klompton/vlcsnap-2014-08-05-13h59m23s61_zpsfbf74d0c.png[/url]

LaMotta-Dellicurti:
[url]http://i1184.photobucket.com/albums/z335/klompton/vlcsnap-2014-08-05-13h59m47s107_zpsd1550341.png[/url]

LaMotta-Bell 3:
[url]http://i1184.photobucket.com/albums/z335/klompton/vlcsnap-2014-08-05-14h00m44s158_zps9c6a34bd.png[/url]

LaMotta-Raadik (one of my buddies used to spar with Raadik at Johnny Coulon's gym in Chicago back in the early 50s and said Raadik never washed his gym clothes. He said Raadik stank so bad nobody wanted to work with him and going into a clinch with him would make your eyes water):
[url]http://i1184.photobucket.com/albums/z335/klompton/vlcsnap-2014-08-05-18h07m35s33_zps9df7e213.png[/url]
[url]http://i1184.photobucket.com/albums/z335/klompton/vlcsnap-2014-08-05-18h08m10s128_zps3ecb6011.png[/url]
[url]http://i1184.photobucket.com/albums/z335/klompton/vlcsnap-2014-08-05-18h08m37s155_zps03c1e4bc.png[/url]
[url]http://i1184.photobucket.com/albums/z335/klompton/vlcsnap-2014-08-05-18h09m40s238_zpsaeaadaab.png[/url]
[url]http://i1184.photobucket.com/albums/z335/klompton/vlcsnap-2014-08-05-18h10m07s28_zps87c5aa55.png[/url]
[url]http://i1184.photobucket.com/albums/z335/klompton/vlcsnap-2014-08-05-18h12m02s154_zpscc9a3f8b.png[/url]
[url]http://i1184.photobucket.com/albums/z335/klompton/vlcsnap-2014-08-05-14h00m06s36_zps1595beaa.png[/url]

Joey LaMotta vs Fernand Demers:
[url]http://i1184.photobucket.com/albums/z335/klompton/vlcsnap-2014-08-05-13h59m41s42_zps74a71cac.png[/url]
Joey LaMotta vs Gene Boland:
[url]http://i1184.photobucket.com/albums/z335/klompton/vlcsnap-2014-08-05-14h00m55s13_zps5d08d8a5.png[/url]

 

Damn, I am really jealous. I would love to see these films.

 

I've never said they shouldn't be ranked highly.
Yes, they have been given recognition and I think there are many other middleweights of the 30s/40s era who haven't yet got the same recognition because they don't fit that criteria.
For example, Ken Overlin, doesn't always get his due.

Personally, I'd have no problem seeing Holman Williams as a top 5 or 6 all-time middleweight.
It's just I can see beyond the "BMR".

I tend to rate fighters as individuals anyway.

 

A thing about LaMotta, he says he didn't even have a manager, he was certainly not well-managed. He was probably unmanageable.

Yes, give him all the credit for fighting other avoided fighters (black or otherwise) and other contenders 'on the outside' of the title picture, but realize that it didn't really make sense. By his own admission the only way he got a shot was doing the mob a favour by losing to Billy Fox.

Boxing is a business, a system, a racket. Good management steers fighters through and gets them the shot, or not. The aim is to make money, and not get ripped off or used as cannon fodder in dead-end fights.

 

This is true, and also why I would take Capriano's words about the Zivic contest with a grain of salt. Capriano was LaMotta's manager in name only, just like Joey was later, and just like Silvani was his trainer in name only (basically a hired gun in the corner). LaMotta was self managed and self trained, which is damn remarkable but also one reason he had to wait so long to get a shot. You had to have a front man for the mob managing you or owning a piece of you to get anywhere and LaMotta wouldn't play that game. He hated Capriano and actually kicked the **** out of him and forced Capriano to sign a release of their contract after which Capriano went to the law. It was a fairly big controversy at the time.

 

La Motta has a far greater resume, besides you should never take the word of a boxer when they are talking about a fellow competitor.

 

I agree with all the above. These are individual fighters with individual strengths,abilities and levels of accomplishment. They were not a "team". That is a degrading concept to the best of them.

If anyone needs reassessment it is Freddie Steele. He's in the argument for top 3 IMO.