Lomachenko; is he a H2H beast all time?

Very talented fighter but his resume is too short to compare him to the elite in history

 

Sure, but I personally cannot project a future where Teo and Haney are spoken of alongside Duran and Benny Leonard and Sweet Pea Whitaker or other ATGs at 135. Whereas Sal Sanchez is in most every top 10 all-time at feather and in many top fives.

And while you and others may, I personally don’t see Loma anymore as someone ‘moving up in weight’ — he hasn’t fought below lightweight since like 2017. Maybe he could make that weight still and do so without completely draining himself but maybe not … but regardless, he’s been a lightweight for long enough now that he’s a lightweight.

I think a fighter moving up in weight can enhance resume but I don’t personally see Loma as some featherweight or junior lightweight fighting lightweights at this point. Anymore than I see Duran as a lightweight fighting a welter when he fought Leonard, or Holyfield as a cruiserweight fighting heavyweights after he moved up. Loma is a lightweight and should be judged as such now … he’s just not the best lightweight in the world, judging by results.

And therein lies the rub — Loma is not the best at 135. Duran became the best (albeit briefly) at 147, Holyfield became the best at heavyweight, Ray Robinson became the best at middleweight, etc. Loma won some belts but when he stepped up against the best at those weights he was found wanting.

If Loma went up to welter now and put on a remarkable losing performance against an ATG the way Duran did vs. Hagler, sure, that enhances his reputation in defeat. But a lightweight losing to other lightweight (who are not seen now as anywhere near ATGs) isn’t the same thing.

 

I am not a licensed official by any means and my opinion does not count on the fighters records but Loma was robbed, plain and simple.

 

I'm a Loma fan and really enjoy watching him fight. His skills are a thing of beauty and I thought he deserved that decision against Haney.

Having said that when it comes to H2H there's a couple fighters at 130 and 135 from the past that could have ran him down IMO. Duran, Chavez, Whitaker, Arguello, just to name a few.

 

He'd do very well in his own weight class.

 

Actually Lomachenko would've matched up well with Arguello who struggled with movers see Vilomar Fernandez fight. And also could have some difficulties vs Southpaws see Jose Luis Ramirez fight.

Lomachenko would be a tricky opponent for most although I'm not sure how many actual greats/ATGs he actually beats.

 

Arguello would be able to push Loma on the backfoot and make him tentative of his power, much like how Teofimo did.

Also Arguello has had plenty of success against southpaws such as Rafael Limon, Boza Edwards, Jim Watt, James Busceme, Andrew Gannigan, Rolando Navarrete.

 

Yep. Hey---I have another Loma draw bout hypothetical for you to consider; Nazarov. That'd be another close tough fight.

 

That’s a little bit of a deceptive comparison. Teo was likely around 150 pounds for the Lomachenko fight whereas I’m not sure Arguello would even break 140 or 135 depending on the weigh in limit.

 

Well to be fair Lomachenko did have a legit shoulder injury vs Lopez that he needed surgery on. I don't like to make excuses but Lomachenko virtually threw no punches in the first 6 rounds or so and that's why he pretty much lost the fight, i feel like Lomachenko at 100 percent would've beat Lopez personally.

Arguello did have success vs Southpaws your right but he also had trouble vs Ramirez and Ganigan where he was heavily dropped and rocked in a war. Was it just down to their styles ? since Arguello did beat other Southpaws ? i don't know.

But i do feel like overall Lomachenko's excellent footwork and Southpaw style would be tricky for Arguello, remember Arguello did have some issues vs movers. And i believe Arguello would find Lomachenko a tricky puzzle to solve.

Don't get me wrong i favour Arguello in the fight, but i think it would be a trickier fight for Arguello than maybe you think.

 

Who cares about the 3 losses.. 17 wins is a Joke!

 

To be equally fair, Loma has had trouble with long, straight punchers with some pop in their right hand — Teo for one (Loma didn’t throw punches early because Teo had power and used his range) and Linares dropped him, right?

I also don’t think Loma has Ganigan’s power (no way) nor was he a mover like Vilomar Fernandez, who was tough for anyone to track down.

 

James J. Jeffries only had 19 and he's an all-time great. I'm not comparing Lomachenko and him but I think boxing should be more about quality than quantity. Lomachenko's extensive amateur record help sort out the need to pad his resume with fluff before taking on the world level. In 20 professional bouts, 16 have been for titles. That is 80% of his entire career. Compare that Alvarez (36.5%) or Crawford (43.6%) who came up more traditionally according to their nationalities and you get the sense of how Lomachenko has been moved.

 

Loma was hand gifted most of his fights. He went straight to the top and didnt go through the grinder before hand. Loma was coveted for some reason. In my book 17 wins means nothing. Look at Jamie Munguia for example, 41w 33kos 0L. And the list goes on . And dont try to bring up amateur records cause you look like an amateur. Their are real grinnders out there. Real hungry dogs and Loma is not one of them.

 

I don't think the overall number of wins/losses matter all that much when assessing head-to-head, albeit that the more data the better. In Lomachenko's case, there's perhaps enough there to draw some conclusions about his cross-era prowess, but the problem is that he has spent next to half of his relatively short pro career in a division that I suspect is not conducive to him producing his best work. Conversely, his time spent in the lower divisions has not yielded a whole lot to work with, in terms of his level of opposition.

With regard to the OP's question, I don't see Loma as an all-time H2H beast in any division, but he's more likely to have some success against the best at 130 than he is at 135. That said, if we look at some of the prospective best at 130, there are several names in there that I think Lomachenko would look less than beastly against, e.g. FMJ, JCC, Pacquiao, OdlH, Kid Chocolate, Flash Elorde, Villaflor, Nelson - there are likely more.