Louis vs Frazier

This is one of the closest fights to pick in my opinion. Another is Frazier-Marciano. Louis obviously had a bigger arsenal, but Frazier made up for it with the timing and accuracy of his left hook. Frazier did get hit alot, especially before he got "smokin", and Louis specialized in hitting people accurately and hard. We are familiar with the strong points and shortcomings of both, so if I had to pick, I'd say Joe survives an early knockdown or two and wears Louis down to hurt him and stop him late- like in 12. Frazier KO12

 

Dave what makes you think Frazier survives two knockdowns? Who did Louis ever knock down who he didn't finish?

 

Dave what makes you think Frazier survives two knockdowns? Who did Louis ever knock down who he didn't finish?

 

Tough fight to call outright...Frazier had unbelievable tenacity, and only Foreman made him look rubbish. I see Louis hitting him a lot, but I think Joe would take the punches and come back for more. That left hook would find Louis' chin too, make no mistake about it.
The fight hinges on what Louis does and how he reacts to Joe's pressure, because Frazier didn't have a plan B.
If Godoy's dipping, awkward style gave Louis problems, I think Frazier's style could too. If Louis finds his range and starts to time Frazier early though...this could be a painful night for Frazier.

Ulitmately, I think Louis probably has a bit too much quality for Frazier, but I think this would be a tough, competitive fight throughout with Louis winning on points.

 

Who did Louis fight that was on Frazier's level, physically or mentally?

I was thinking Frazier could be hurt early, and that's what Frazier did when he got dropped- he got up. By the way, Frazier survived two knockdowns in the Bonavena fight and won, and I got the impression from the Foreman fight that Frazier would have had to suffer a broken neck or literally die to keep him frm getting up... Even after the SIXTH knockdown Frazier still got up to try again.

Louis was a first-class finisher, but I think Frazier is on a different determination level than most, if not all of Louis' opponents he finished.

Like I said, it's a tough one to call. If you ask me next week, I might have an argument for Louis. It's close.

 

Marciano

 

We can both agree (I hope) that Louis was a little past it...

 

Obviousely louis was far past your prime, but your question was "Who did Louis fight that was on Frazier's level, physically or mentally?"


So the simple answer is marciano

 

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True, but I think he meant, who did Louis fight and beat in his prime that was on par with Frazier. Frankly, I think if a 1938 Joe Louis fought a 1970 Joe Frazier, Joe would have likely been the toughest contender Louis ever faced. As much respect as I have for Schmeling, Baer, Braddock and Carnera, I really think that Frazier was a step above those guys. We also have to look at styles, and Louis was a fighter who sometimes got cought by left hooks. I can't think of too many fighters who were better left hookers than Frazier. Still, I'd pick Louis to win, but make no mistake about it, this would be a very hard fight for Louis to win. Don't let anyone tell you that Louis's ferocious combinations would lead him to a second round KO like the Foreman fight. Not gonna happen.......

 

This is obvious. ALTHOUGH max baer arguebably was a better puncher than frazier, and bigger too, despite being extremely crude.

He was clearly a step above these guys, but not above baer as a puncher

This is true. But Frazier was a guy who was often caught by right hands, uppercuts.

I cant think of any fighter who was better at using his right hand and uppercuts than Joe Louis

why not? Louis combinations were faster, sharper, deadlier than foremans big bombs.

 

You have made a very reasonable analysis, imo. Frazier was definitely above the Louis opponents you mention.

Frazier-Louis would be an extremely tough fight.

The only difference I would have is that I think Frazier's incessant, unrelenting pressure would eventually get to the great Brown Bomber and the fight would end sometime in the later rounds like 10-12 in favor of Frazier.

p.s. Of course Frazier is famous for the left hook, but if people would take a gander sometimes at Frazier-Ramos and Frazier-Quarry II they would see he could also bang that right in on the inside, both as an overhand and uppercut.

 

You guys are convinving me even more that Louis would KO Frazier. Maybe it's cause I watched Foreman v Frazier #1 last night