Make your case: Convince me Monzon wasnt an average MW Champ

.............Dude, seriously. Post more often.

 

I think you are overrating Monzon's resume a little bit here buddy. Alan Minter and Vito Antuofermo both beat more ranked fighters than Valdez. Mustafa Hamsho also beat quality contenders too. Hence why all 3 make top 50 middleweight threads.

 

Do let us know what your thoughts are of Monzon after you watch some more footage of him, and next time do try and keep an eye out for the subtle things that he does in that ring, you just might be surprised at what you will notice. I would send you that copy of the second Briscoe/Monzon fight that I have so you can see for yourself, but that is a very rare item and I do not wish to release it just yet to the general public.

Glad to see I was able to get you to entertain the idea of watching some more Monzon footage though, the guy really was the goods and while his style might not have been as pleasing to the eye as a Hagler and Jones does for you, that shouldn`t take away from the fact that this guy was a dominant champion in a talented era of fighters.

And keep in mind, by the time he won the title he already had 80 fights leading up to his title shot, so he wasn`t no spring chicken by the time he won the title, yet he still went on to have a dominant reign and this after he had been shot early into his title run... say what you will about the man but very few fighters would have been able to accomplish that in my opinion and it takes a special fighter to do what he did.

 

I will try, but like I mentioned earlier with the long hours I am putting in at work lately it makes it very hard to find the time to post, but in a few weeks time things should slow down at work enough for me to find the time to post more often.

 

He seems slow. But if you watch his fights in slow motion, you see how good he was in the exchanges. Virtually all his punches land, while he hardly ever gets hit.

 

Tampa, you are pulling **** out of your ass. Monzon was not slow, he was smart, measured, paced and switched up on his punching speed. He pawed, baited and sprung on his opponents and was consistent and unrelenting in his attack. Also, he was an absolutely dominant athlete in his prime. That's why his fights can be perceived by the uninitiated as boring. He just dominates his opponents physically and mentally. They have no recourse but to move in reverse and try to cover their comparative deficiencies. Also, where are getting that Benvenuti was slow? Have you ever seen footage of the guy? He was known for his quickness, an asset which Monzon neutralized.

The breakdown of Monzon was overwhelming strength, pacing, baiting and countering, a withering style which led him to dominate a great era of ONE BELT. It did not hurt that he had a chin of absolute steel and devilish resolve, two assets never broken by a string of powerhitting challengers.

This argument against his greatness is just historical denial. It is so overwhelming disproven by the facts as to be made laughable.

 

I never mentioned Valdez's resume, I was mentioning his status as a fighter, one who I see as quite a bit better than either of the two top wins for Hagler. Briscoe as well, Benvenuti as well.

 

Please explain how briscoe is better? He was never ranked in the p4p like Antuofermo was. Vito actually beat some solid fighters during his heyday, Briscoe nearly lost every big fight he was in.

At least Vito beat middleweights like hugo corro, briscoe, etc. It seems like every fighter nino beat was a smaller man, there is no middleweight on his resume.

 

Valdez was better, Briscoe and Benvenuti were on their level.

I'd choose Briscoe over Antuofermo in a head to head matchup, I was saying this in literal terms, which is why I made it clear I wasn't talking about resumes.

 

I think thier outcome would have been the same, regardless of when they fought. Briscoe was still ranked top 5 when Vito beat him and Benny was still beating the 2nd tier contenders.Vito beat Hugo Corro, and i'm not sure if you have seen Corro fight, but his style would beat Briscoe 7/10 times.

Briscoe and Minter would have been a 50/50 fight. Either Briscoe cuts him or gets a boxing lesson from minter. However, Minter beat twice as many ranked fighters and was THE Champ when Hagler beat him, so his win means more anyways.

Another thing, I would pick valdez to beat Hamsho but, Hamsho would stop Nino Benventui in my opinion.

 

Im seconding this, great post Raging Bull, and you, and you alone. were able to sway Tampa Nights!

 

One of the best posts I've read on Monzon. All I can add to this is to say that Monzon, like Ali, was a master ring general, who was able to deal with, and exploit anything an opponent offer inthe ring. This attribute offset and compensated for the lack of flashy, athletic gifts that so many fans seem to discredit Monzon for. He was, in my opinion, the greatest middleweight champion of all, and it may me called phenominal that a guy that it dismissed as "slow and stiff" could nevertheless figure out and defeat any of the champions of history. He had the sense to stay in his ideal division, where he was most suited, and just as important, fought and beat the best of his time and THEN did something very unique, and retired on top, unbeaten as champion. Unlike so many other greats, he was never humbled by a beating, or a knockout defeat at the end of his career. Think about it, walking away from the game while on top, there's a mystique about that, that only Marciano, Tunney and though it was obviously under different circumstances, Salvador Sanchez can claim, and that's to not have lost their titles in the ring. Monzon, to his credit, has this distinction after more years as champion and more defenses than these other three examples.

 

I agree with you about Hugo Corro. It's a shame that he's so denigrated by boxing fans, as he was a good, safety first type of defensive specialist, a type of fighter I have a great appreciation for. It's a style that so many fans seem to despise.

 

Fullmer was clearly past his prime by the time he took on tiger in all 3 fights, and he still held tiger to a draw. Doubt the other guys, but dont doubt gene fullmer. he was a great middleweight, a tough SOB!!!!!

 

I think I love you:think

:good