Mancini has 'flashbacks' watching Pavlik on Saturday

So Pavlik supposedly lost to Hopkins because 170 was too big and lost to Martinez because 160 was too small. It seems like he's a fighter without a division.

 

Agree. His career is far from over.

Back to the original post. I don't like the weight being an excuse simply because I had a feeling it might be a problem when posts came in that Pavlik had put on upper body muscle and came into camp 185-190...I don't think you should go that high above if you're gonna have to boil down 25-30 pounds it can be a problem, so that's not an excuse...it's a mistake.

To a degree, the hypothesis that Pavlik has problems with "movers" has been verified. He had good moments in the middle rounds and he deserves credit for that where others have tried to dismiss it. However, Martinez was too much this fight. Props for Martinez.

 

I don't know, I always found his punches looked quite sluggish and shots that really hurt people didn't look that powerful, he just had deceptive power, really epitomises the description "heavy hands". Kind of like the way that Foreman didn't look as powerful as someone like Tyson, but even a clubbing shot was actually very heavy and very hurtful.

I think Froch would be the best fight for Pavlik if he does move up as Froch is easy to hit and thinks he is a better boxer than he is too. Pavlik could definitely hurt him, but Froch is tough and causes people problems that you wouldn't expect him to. Beating Pascal is a prime example. I don't see Pavlik being able to frustrate Froch or land as easily as Taylor and Dirrell (in the rare moments of actual boxing) because he is very telegraphed and has average hand speed.

It would be a brawl and whilst Pavlik has the edge in power, it is not much in my opinion, but I would say Froch can take more of what KP dishes out than vice versa.

 

Well, if he's ballooning up too much between fights and has to come all the way down it can sometimes make a fighter feel flat. However, I think another reason why his punches seemed to lack the snap is that since Martinez moves around so much and Pavlik's footwork being what it is, he didn't always get his feet fully set all the time to have great leverage on his shots. I think its possible, anyways.

 

You have, in a succinct sentence or two, hit the nail on the proverbial head. Of all his flaws, the one you articulated might be the most damaging and injurious to his health and career. Here's a guy who hits hard, has a good beard, and a height advantage over many opponents, yet he-- as you outline-- shows a curious reluctance to throw bombs and let the chips fall where they may.

Since he possesses but modest boxing skills, Pavlik's best chance of delivering that money maker right hand occurs when his opponent engages him and makes mistakes or miscalculations of their own, thereby creating potential openings for him. Does he honestly think he's going to deliver that shot when a guy like Martinez or Hopkins is set and waiting for him????

It's akin to collecting a rebound after a missed shot in a basketball game, and then rather than push the ball and operate against a defense in transition and not altogether set, walking the ball up court and running your half-court offense against there set, established, half-court defense.

 

It wasn't the cut. You could see from the very first second of round 9 that Martinez stepped up the pace and that Pavlik couldn't follow.
Weight? Could be. I'd like to see him at 168 next. 160 is dead anyway, leave it for the prospects.

 

This man is on it, once again. :deal

 

Great tribute to Ray Boom Boom Mancini.There was a film about him aswell,Heart of a champion.

 

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kelly dont care about youngstown or fighting all hes thanking is of the next free drink

 

Gotta give Martinez his credit too. He took a few good right hands in there and wasn't fazed during the times when he wasn't off balance.

Pavlik's one shot power might be a bit overrated. I doubt he'll even carry what he has up to 168, if he decides to move up. Kelly does have power, but it does seem to be more of the accumulation type (as people have said before).

 

Hermit really misses his Boo.

 

The moment that cut on the left eye opened in the 1st round, I said it would be stopped on cuts in the 9th round... then a cut opened up under the eye. Pavlik was finally able to protect that eye but then there was a cut under the right eye and Martinez played Connect Four for the rest of the night. When the entire board popped out in the 9th, there was absolutely no point for the fight to continue.

 

technically he's not that good, that's why he gets outboxed. his defense is very bad.

 

Exactly -- something is seriously wrong, and I do not buy the "styles make fights" argument. Prior to the Hopkins fight we never, ever, saw Pavlik unwilling to trade punches. And we certainly never saw him unwilling to let his hands go. Martinez just isn't that hard to hit. Pavlik landed around 40% of his punches for 5 straight rounds, and still never really let his hands go.

He's only 28, but he started boxing at 9 years of age. After 19 years, 9 years as an amatuer and 10 years as a pro, he may be at a place where he just doesn't want it anymore.