Manny Pacquiao an ATG at the lower weights

Manny Pacquiao is the king of an underrated and rarely brought into discussion, attribute. Heroism. Not to be confused with heart or will.

 

Yeah Pacquiao is good at lower weights, but he is better at 135- 147. Pacquiao nowadays throws certain combinations and punches from different angles that I have not seen him do before. Pacquiao's foot speed, positioning and balance are also better compare before.

 

That is the problem with Pacquiao for me. We have seen essentially two different versions of him, both with flaws that trouble him when it comes to head-to-head ATG match-ups.

At the lower weights, he had the speed and power to trouble anyone, but he was far more hittable, more one-dimensional and a bit left-hand happy. When he comes up against prime greats from 112 to 126, those flaws are going to be exposed and ultimately, he might end up beaten.

At the higher weights, from 135 to 147, he's a far improved fighter as is evident for all to see, more adaptable, more patient in his approach, much improved defensively, he's developed his right hand better and his punch placement has improved aswell.

But when coming up again against prime greats at those weights, he is going to struggle with the sheer size and power of some of those guys. I mean can you imagine him taking Hearns' right hand over and over? Or dealing with the physical strength and power of Armstrong?

 

Well, that means that he is an ATG based on resume and overall accomplishments, not head to head in fantasy match-ups. I meant in the lower weights, he has those flaws, yet he still accomplished much, and at the higher weights, he did the same despite being physically smaller.

 

The Pacman H2H conundrum rears its ugly head again. I find myself stuck in the same Pac logic puzzle when rating him.

 

I dont think so. I actually think hes gotten better at the higher weights because of his tremendous advantage in speed. He has the power he has the chin, but he also has the ability to really outspeed the bigger guys.

We havent seen someone able to offset it yet at welter, but at the lower weights it happened a bit more. Thats why Freddie Roach wanted no part of Mosley, and what makes the fight with Mayweather so interesting. Basic boxing by a fighter that has Mayweathers speed and timing should offset a lot of Pac's quick footwork.

 

Oh undoubtedly. He achieved some great things at the lower weights and should be commended for that. Certainly an ATG in terms of his accomplishments and resumé from 112-126/130.

It's a strange one, because you look at what he's achieved and think that he should be a Henry Armstrong type, ranking highly H2H across a number of weights. But because of those major flaws highlighted, he doesn't for me.

 

When Pacquiao retires and we are only discussing him here in the Classic, I think I will be much happier. What a joy it is to have a reasoned discussion about Pacquiao for once.

 

Hank's in my top 3, Pacman's in my top 30, although I've gone back and forth on where. Never had him on as short a list as top 15 like Bert "I love my dead boyfriend, Jack Dempsey" Sugar said he does, but I've had him all over 20-30 this past year.

 

Wait, let me jump in and "Generalize" this thread.








Stupid *******! The catchweight king ain't ****! He's ducking Floyd and drug tests! Why was a flyweight's head bigger than Clottey's? Answer me that, huh? :rofl:rofl:rofl:rofl

 

Let's not go over the top with this craft and intelligence stuff, he went from being technically inept in many ways and relying a helluva lot on speed, power and his straight left, to a bit more patient, two handed and refined, but not with G-man like boiled down weight advantages anymore.

Pac is a physical marvel and great weightjumper but he's not become some uber master boxer-puncher that would be an unbeatable god like if we combine the best attributes from his varying weight-class incarnations.The two Marquez fights highlight that perfectly imo, against real A level fighters the two versions pose different issues, both very formidable and one not necessarily clearly superior to the other.

 

Pac has amazing stamina, that's really the best thing about the guy.