Manny Pacquiao vs. Donald Curry at WW

I think I'd still make the 85 Curry the favorite here. He was HEAD and SHOULDERS a better fighter then Cotto, and Margarito. But having said that.... anybody who counts Manny out in this fight is being foolish.

His speed, angles, power, and STAMINA makes him an extremely live threat against Curry, and no... I'm not a *******. But the man is just an amazing fighter, and even though I wouldnt like his chances against Leonard, Duran, and Hearns... Curry was a notch below those 3 men... so Manny has a legit chance here.

 

Why? Did you and Boxed Ears bet against Pacquiao against Margarito?

 

Pac vs Barrera always reminds me of Curry vs Honeyghan for some reason.Honeyghan before he changed his style for the worse was somewhat like an orthodox Pac in execution, though wilder with his punches.He used quick feet to get in and out, working the overhand right off the sudden rushes into range.

Technically Curry is a really bad match for Manny, in that like Marquez he excels against someone he can plant and punchpick with...and he's much more refined at it than JMM.

Howver on the other hand Manny is all wrong for him technically as well.Exactly the kind of awkward hard hitting offensive fighter who he doesn't seem to cope well with.

P4P i'd feel comfortable going with Pac, but at Welter gimme Curry.Donald's offensive arsenal and power would be a bit too much to deal with, and he's so quick himself with single shots and short combinations.

 

although the 1985Curry is better than the guys Pacman has beaten recently.

 

Anyone who isn't totally overrating Curry should IMO.

Personally, I would expect Pac's all-around speed, fire, workrate, and unpredictability to be too much for the methodical Curry.

Pac is an ATG, Curry was just a very good fighter who fell short of any real greatness.

 

I didn't. But I've been a committed devil's advocate for his opponents since Diaz. Not to say favor by any means at all, but.. I've been skeptical of his likelihood of success when others have seemingly been convinced that there's no reason to think he's not bulletproof to any kind of offense from far bigger men, which I've found irrational and actually unfair in really rating his victories.

 

I can't disagree at all. But, unfortunately, the only welterweight guy on the level or better than the best welterweight version of Curry would be...Mayweather, imo.

 

Yeah that's fair, and I agree. In terms of current importance a win over say Clottey isn't the biggest deal because they are both established welters, but in hindsight and or when rating his career they are of more importance because the fact is that he is fighting naturally bigger men who are factoring into the world ratings. It's just the Margo fight that gets me, it's a nothing fight that he was expected to do what he did in. Margo is a nobody at 154. I respect Pac as a man for what he did, taking the shots of a big hard man like Margarito, but in boxing terms i don't rate it at all.

 

Honestly, I feel a little bit like some posters who have mentioned this, and I don't know if it makes any sense but I "feel" like that was really a welterweight accomplishment that strayed north a few pounds. That's how I look at it and I certainly have to rate that, looking from that perspective. It had nothing to do with light middleweight accomplishments or that title. It's part of his great leap to fight three top-notch welterweight names of the past three or four years, to me. When I look at him as being a natural lightweight to light welterweight.

 

Nah you ****ing fanboy *****! It was at light-middle!

(kidding)

What can I say? It was at light-middle BE. It's interesting though that if we are to say it was a welter win, as you say,then it's similar to what I said about the Clottey fight. Not much in terms of current boxing, because Margo's standing wasn't much at the time of the fight, but in hindsight it's what you said, a win over one over one of the top welters of the era, very nice in that regard.

That's if you consider it a welter win though, because technically you could simply say that Margo is a nobody at light-middle, and this fight was at that weight. When you consider that they have tried to pass it off as a light middleweight championship fight as well.

 

Margarito was rated well at 154 by the WBC though, having won the International title against a so-so enough Garcia. That's why he was slated to fight for the vacant title in the first place. That doesn't mean much to me, but I'll bring it up to hide the hurt of the ***** remark. ...But really more for that "fanboy" remark, because that **** stings. (Not a particularly big Pacquiao fan, oddly enough, by the way) Anyway, I also consider Duran's win over Cuevas to be a welterweight accomplishment, even though it was north of that weight, to draw comparisons. Cuevas was fairly faded and it wasn't at welter but I don't discount that win like some people do. I still consider it part of the Duran legacy.

Other examples are Oscar over Hernandez, which I consider a Super Feather kind of win, (Hernandez was nobody at lightweight, right?). I'd consider Robinson over Angott (I) to really be a lightweight win, though it strayed north ever so slightly. I don't think it's that off base, really.



Edit: Going back, when I said I don't consider it valuable for that weight class, I don't understand the significance of being "someone" at 154. We all know whether we would like to admit it or not, that Margarito was a titlist level fighter for most of the decade (because he actually was a titlist for most of the decade, having three of the four major ABC belts at different points) regardless of which weight class. I consider victories over champions as being legacy-enhancing, because they are "of a certain caliber" regardless. I also suspect that Margarito was made to look worse by an ATG than he really might be in terms of questioning whether he was faded or just done for. He might surprise some people and become a 154 titlist in the future. I really wonder. I haven't written him off.

 

Yeah that's fine, no objections here. My standpoint on the likes of Duran-Cuevas and Pac-Margo is that they are fights that we can use objectively as evidence to say how Duran/Pac would do against similar fighters as Cuevas/Margo at 147 but when it comes to rating their resumes I just rate them according to the weight class they were fought in.

But like I said, no objections at all to your style of doing it BE, you've actually made me consider a review of things I seem to be possible going overboard on the techniaclities!

 

This conversation that we're having...I've had hundreds of them with just myself as I mull over my own list. Maybe I should be committed, granted, but I'll play the part I'm playing now, then I'll play the part you're playing and I'll go 'round and 'round at all hours. It's all proof of how hardcore we are, imo. :yep

 

Hardcore indeed:good

I think I might debate with myself who is better between Pongsaklek Wonjongkam and Gavin Ress now