If you had said Pea beats him over 12, that's fine, but you worded it as if to say Manny doesn't belong in the ring with Whitaker. I think he does, and it would be a very tough and competitive fight regardless of the outcome. I remember one poster indicating that it was a very exciting fight.
It's not Sugar Ray Robinson at Welter he's fighting.Pea was very resilient, i'd say it's unlikely he would be bothered too much by the kind of raw power Pac has at this weight.Even at lightweight really.
Whilst Pac is great at letting combos go, he's not that proficient in setting combo's up imo. That's part of the reason he had so much trouble with JMM. He couldn't get JMM into a position to launch his combinations because JMM kept countering him every time he tried to get set in combo throwing mode. As such, Pac was made to look somewhat ordinary. I don't see why Whitaker wouldn't emulate that in a more proficient manner really. If anything he'll just make Pac miss more and stick him with the jab and break his rhythm up repeatedly on top of the countering feast he'll have.
A couple of things here. First of all, I don't agree that he's not good at sending up combos. I think he's very good at setting up combos. Very good at getting slightly outside a given angle and letting his hands go at the appropriate time. He never ever hesitates when he thinks he has that angle, and although this has a very specific consequence relating to Marquez, it's the lesser of two evils for a fighter who isn't going to have great success boxing off the back foot. He also has under-rated feinting, and he can put a fighter into position for a punch with his feints. Here is a great right-hand feint with a left-hand punch, which happens to be my favourite kind: http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v637/Zero1gouki/pac1.gif Now, the fact that he moves into position and looks to punch makes him vulnerable to a world-class counter-puncher -- this is why Whitaker would always beat him (prime), that as much as anything -- but it should be noted that inspite of the fact that Marquez has as big a style advantage as is possible over Pacman, and inspite of the fact that he is absolutely world-class, Marquez has been unable to beat Pacman under the rules of boxing (I had the first one a draw, and the second one to Marquez by a point - but this was not a robbery). He has also improved, not insignificantly, since the second Marquez fight.
How come you wanted him to lose before? I've always enjoyed watching Manny perform to his high level. I don't believe Pacquiao wins against a prime Whitaker, ever myself. I've been posting about him in loads of threads here and on British lately, and i just don't get the big thing about the win over Margarito. I got it about the Cotto one, and then he confirmed it all over again vs Clottey. But we get it now, it doesn't matter how big they are, if he's better than them and they have a style suited to him, (or have holes in their make-up like Cotto), then he will win convincingly. I'm not taking from his win, it is what it is though, not a relevant win in boxing today regardless of what an alphabet body will tell us. He has the best resume in boxing today, no doubt, he's a legend, i'm a fan. Whitaker would definitely beat him (not clown him, **** that disrespect off), in my opinion.
Check his avatar. But i agree with McGrain, Pacquiao has become really quite good at feinting and drawing, he did a superb job of it in the Cotto fight. It's how he got his knockdowns.
Watch the Morales fight. Green Pacquaio, not saying he was at his best, but its revealing I think in how scoring a Whitaker fight would go. Pac was competitive and landed punches the whole way through. Morales just timed his rushes and picked his spots so beautifully, that you remember the stuff he landed. It was simply better, flashier, sharper. I feel Pac-Whitaker at 147 would be competitive till the end, but Whitaker would be in front on virtue of the better, showier connects. I don't know if their is a finer fighter head to head at 135...Whitaker wins wide down there, in my opinion. He was even harder to catch.
http://www.eastsideboxing.com/forum/showthread.php?t=267735 and, http://www.eastsideboxing.com/forum/showthread.php?t=267974
Mac, why wasn't he able to get combos off on Marquez? I think it's because Marquez kept on countering him before he could set up to throw them. Don't you think this would be a problem whenever he faces guys that counter well? I mean, sure he can rat-a-tat the Margo's and Clottey's and hurt Cotto's of the world, but I don't think he is inventive enough when it comes to finding ways to let combinations fly when he has someone punching back and also breaking his rhythm. Edit: just went back and re-read your post - you probably don't disagree with anything I've written there - but I am making the claim that Pac will have trouble setting combos up on guys that can find him on the counter and disrupt his flow - not sure if you really agree with that statement....