March 4, 1968: Frazier stops Buster Mathis (who was about the size of Lennox Lewis)

What a three dollar bill you are .. Typical .. flat out wrong and when exposed arrogantly tries to intellectualize a rebuttal, something you're as poor at as civility.

Lennox Lewis was a supremely well conditioned athlete from 228 to 250 or so . He was bigger, taller, and far more "robust" than Mathis ever was. Nice .. your definition of "bigger" excludes height, reach, width of shoulders but focuses on flabby waists, thighs and rear ends it seems .. LOL .. Was Butterbean more robust too ? Try using Google before you use vocabulary beyond your jr. high sweet spot.

Mathis was gigantic as an amateur , had a few years as a pro when he trimmed down comparatively speaking but was still body flabby ( a poor man's Tony Tubbs) and then ballooned again.

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Stick to being an archivist, a place where you can hide from the world.

 

Lol, this "critique" coming from a guy who is rapidly getting a reputation as one of the most inane posters on this forum. Why dont you stick to posts about how protected Robinson was, how Jack Johnson was losing to Flynn, how Sullivan sucks if we throw out half of his career... you know, your usual drivel lacking in either thought or context. Ill stick to my assertion and take comfort in the fact that it diverges from yours, meaning im likely correct seeing as you are so often incorrect to the point of ridicule.

 

God is it easy to get in your narrow skull. Keep preaching to your trolls loser.

 

Im preaching to trolls because you disagree that without steroids lewis was not a bigger guy than Mathis? Lol. Talk about a thin skinned crank. You post your silly ass bull**** trying to denigrate recognized greats and then have the nerve to accuse people of trolling when you rightly get called out for it. Thats funny. Please, keep up with the history lessons mr. "historian" Oh, and btw if you want to post your actual degree in history ill do likewise. My guess is as usual when challenged youll leave me waiting because one of us has two degrees in the field and twenty years worth of work under his belt and that aint you pal. Lol. "Historian" Ha! You might as well write "brain surgeon" in crayon on a piece of paper and hang it outside your door. It carries the same weight as your avatar and doesnt make you any more a brain surgeon than you are a "historian"

 

This should be the end of a discussion that should never have started in the first place... This forum sometimes.

Duran would have been CW in his 30s if he didn't trim down in training. So that makes him as big as Holyfield? Madness.

 

Its not madness. To suggest that beating Mathis is a gauge for Frazier beating Lewis is madness, they were totally different animals, but to suggest they arent similar in size is ridiculous. Lewis had one inch in height and a few inches in reach and nothing discernible in weight particularly before he mysteriously added 20 pounds of ripped muscle to his lanky frame at almost 30 years old. Some on here want to ignore that and pretend Lewis came out of the womb a ripped 245 pounds like he did against Holyfield looking like a pro bodybuilder. You put Lewis off steroids next to Mathis and you will see Mathis was a naturally big man even when well trained. Broad shoulders, big arms, thick legs, etc. Its not a crazy comparison despite what a pinhead like Grant who doesnt know his ass from a hole in the ground might want to believe.

 

Agreed.

 

Buster should have plus a bra.

 

2 inches in height, 8 inches in reach. 8 is more than "a few", I'd say. And the only reason he had a similar weight to Lewis was that he was fat, as we keep repeating. So let's say he would be 215-220 lbs if he had the same percentage body fat as Lewis. So 6'3 and 215-220 lbs. Not a very unusual size for 60's, 70's HWs. What was usual was someone so overweight.

 

Instead of being a lazy boxrec warrior why dont you actually go back and read contemporary tales of the tape. Mathis was 6'3.5" tall (not the 6'3" boxrec lists), only one and half inches shorter than Lewis and yes, before Lewis started taking steroids he weighed regularly in 220s and low 230s. You are aware, I hope (since you chose to open your mouth on the subject) that Mathis did indeed weigh in in the 220s on occasion and was in damn good shape in the 230s. If youve ever seen him at the weigh ins for Chuvalo, Quarry, or even Frazier youd see he was enormous, just a big man. He dwarfed those guys. None of whom were huge heavyweights but the fact that he made them look small illustrates how big he was naturally even in shape. He was certainly no smaller than Ali when they fought, who was no smaller than Foreman, who was every bit as big as Lennox Lewis. And frankly its a little odd that you would say Mathis was somehow artificially heavy because he was overweight but continue to ignore the fact that Lewis was artificially heavy due to steroids. So yes, in terms of size he was comparable to Lewis. Lewis may have looked better, particularly after roiding up, but its boxing, not a body building contest and Mathis, despite his girth, was a very talented boxer. I think thats really the issue here, that you and some others dont take him seriously because he didnt look the part to you. Anyone who has seen his fights can see he was very fluid, very skilled, and very athletic. You can continue to dispute that but it just makes you look as ill informed as Grant. Like I said, Im not arguing that Frazier beating Mathis gives comparisons to how he would do against Lewis. Two different styles completely. But the size of the two is definately negligible.

 

People seriously think lennox just "naturally" grew into the 240-250 range despite being in his 30's? Theyre just gonna ignore the fact as an amateur and for most of his 20's he came in at 220ish with a lean, lanky, shredded frame then suddenly became a big beefy, stocky power house?

If you look at his photos, its almost like comparing a sprinter to a chubby power lifter!

 

He was 231 at 26 years old and 242 at 34 years old. And he was hardly ripped as got older. That's a modest weight gain for an aging athlete. The smaller Joe Louis went up about the same weight over time. Certainly Johnson did as did Ali.

I'm neither endorsing nor denying that the guy was on the juice but without a positive test or a Evan Fields type smoking gun, I feel the jury must weigh upon Not Guilty.

 

Agreed.

 

Jesus. Why don't you just give over?

The Lewis we are talking about is the full grown version. Otherwise we could start with "Kovalev was almost the size if Ali, Johnson and Louis" and other BS. It shows how you try and stretch the argument that you constantly go back to a younger version.

And nobody has said "Mathis was the size Lewis would have been if he was not on steroids". (Not that I have ever seen a shred of proof that Lewis was on steroids). That you bring alleged steroids in the discussion is another example of you not approaching this honestly.

And Mathis was always tubby. I don't believe he would have been over 220 lbs if he had Lewis body fat percentage.

In short, Lewis packed clearly more muscle, was taller and had substantially longer reach. So, no, they were not the same size.

Now I'm done with you.

 

Ive been around gyms long enough to know that a lanky fighter in his mid twenties participating in a cardio intensive sport doesnt add 20+ pounds of muscle and start looking like this naturally. [url]https://dbuff82.files.wordpress.com/2015/11/evander-holyfield-vs-lennox-lewis-fight-1.jpg?w=840[/url]

You might believe that fairy tale bull**** but I dont. I KNOW better. If you want to go on believing that bull**** because you are a Lewis fan or just think its going to win you an argument on the internet then so be it but Lennox Lewis in his mid twentoes in shape was at best a 225 pound string bean who in his mid thirties was a 245 pound ripped bodybuilder. Sorry but guys with his build spend lifetimes in the gym trying to 3 or 4 pounds of lean muscle while abstaining from cardio and consider themselves damn lucky to get it. But I guess Lewis just had some contaminated beef...