You say "if" Rocky spoke to Shulberg as though you entertain the possibility he may have been lying. Shulberg was around boxing all his life he was friends with Billy Soose and his manager Paul Moss ,,and sparred with Billy.he was friends with Angelo Dundee and shared a hotel room with him in Zaire ,he was friends with Jose Torres,Ali,RayArcel ,George Parnassus, Marciano and managed Archie McBride.If Rocky asked him for his honest opinion, I guess he must have valued it.
So was everyone Ali beat first time around past their primes. Moore, Liston, Patterson, Cooper, Foley, Williams. ...Norton and Frazier beat him. Foreman was prime at least, but this is Ali, perhaps the greatest champion. That’s a lot of past prime guys. So was everyone Tyson beat past their prime. Holmes, Spinks, Berbick, Thomas.. Douglas, Holyfield and Lewis beat him. Holyfield? Dokes, Douglas, Foreman And Holmes all past their primes. ...Lewis, Moorer And Bowe beat him. This rule works for each and every champion. It’s not exclusive.
Patterson was past it, three times knocked out for the title. Against Ali Floyd was limping around with a bad back too. were Jones and Chuvalo really greater fighters than 34-1 Layne or 37-0 Lastarza? It is a comparable point don’t you think?
Let's see....ages....hmmm....well...Liston was appox. 12 yrs older than Ali...Patterson was 7 yrs older...Folley was 11 yrs older...London was 8 yrs older...Williams was 9 yrs older...Mildenburger was 5 yrs older...Cooper was 8 yrs older...Moore was appox. 26 yrs older...Chuvalo was 5 yrs older.....still wanna talk ages??? This is against prime Ali...not the punching bag of the 1970's...
Hey, you know your not allowed to say this right? According to the logic of some this stuff only applies to smaller men beating bigger fighters. Not bigger fighters beating smaller men.
No I don’t rate Schulberg as a boxing person. Don’t get me wrong, great writer, great story teller with an interest in boxing, but he’s not a boxing guy. To me, Rocky talking to a journalist “for an opinion” is another way for Rocky to keep his name out there. He’s a retired guy looking for more bookings. What’s he going to do “hey can you white something about me making an appearance somewhere” or is he going to say something news worthy like “I think I can beat Liston”.
Being a boxer, being a coach, a matchmaker, a sparring partner these are the things that make a real boxing insider. Writers or investors of boxers and friends of boxers are not the same. They have information not insight. Don’t believe any of that crap about Schulberg sparring people. The guy was tiny. Photo opportunity at most.
Patterson did have a bad back vs Ali Chuvalo was definitely better than lastarza. Chuvalo fought everyone. Roland hid in mob controlled New York
The plucky little guy with his lunch pail would have had a rude awakening, as did the entire sporting world, upon the advent of the modern athlete.
A comeback Marciano has slim to no chance against Sonny. Both men prime, a lot closer, but I'd still lean towards Liston.
Chuvalo lost to Pete radmacher and Joe Erskine. He was even coming off a loss when he fought Ali for the title. Layne and Lastarza were on impressive win streaks when Rocky fought them. Dont get me wrong, George was certainly a handful for anyone but much of what can be said of him can be said about most other decent contenders. Lastarza and Layne are also decent. I dont see a gulf between them and chuvalo at all.
