Marciano deserves a lot of respect

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by mrkoolkevin, Apr 15, 2016.



  1. swagdelfadeel

    swagdelfadeel Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Man these Marciano haters can be crazy.
     
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  2. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    I tend to put them in the same bracket, but they derived their mental strength from different sources.

    In Evander Holyfield’s case he drew strength from his religious faith, and in Rocky Marciano’s case he drew strength from his obsessive compulsive disorder.
     
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  3. mrkoolkevin

    mrkoolkevin Never wrestle with pigs or argue with fools Full Member

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    Ali showed great mental strength too.
     
  4. reznick

    reznick In the 7.2% Full Member

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    Tyson and Lewis are unicorns. Those guys will be a tough matchup for any heavyweight in history.


    Nobody will turn red if you pick Tyson over Marciano. It's the Tucker/Tubbs/Page/Berbick comparisons that we feel are a bit loony.
     
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  5. Pugilist_Spec

    Pugilist_Spec Hands Of Stone Full Member

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    Hater? So everyone who disagrees with you is a hater?

    Holyfield displayed herculean heart in the ring. He took far more punishment in his career than Marciano did and always fought back with fire against younger, bigger fighters. Marciano is not on another level. That's nonsense.
     
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  6. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    Yes, and that was mainly down to manic self-belief.
     
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  7. reznick

    reznick In the 7.2% Full Member

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    Holyfield had incredible heart. He had many of the great characteristics of Marciano.

    But I agree that Rocky was on another level. He wouldn't just stand up to your punches, he would come after you non stop.
     
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  8. Pugilist_Spec

    Pugilist_Spec Hands Of Stone Full Member

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    And so would Evander. Rocky had an incredible will but let's not act like he was some phenom in this department. Plenty of champions have overcome greater setbacks.
     
  9. mrkoolkevin

    mrkoolkevin Never wrestle with pigs or argue with fools Full Member

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    But what exactly is so loony about believing that Marciano would have a very difficult time against a fighter with Tucker's physical traits and style? Whenever we try to have these discussions it usually devolves into Marciano's fans ranting about his "class" and "ATGness," or going on about who Tucker did or didn't ever beat.
     
  10. RockysSplitNose

    RockysSplitNose Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I don't see any better performance on film by Jersey Joe Walcott than the one he put in against Rock in the first fight - so that to me is the best version of Walcott.

    And similarly no other Ezzard Charles performance on film impressed me quite as much as the one he put in against Marciano the first fight so again for me the most impressive version of Charles on film for me (and my favourite EVER fight to boot).

    Archie Moore said himself his finest night was his loss to Marciano - I agree I don't think there's a better version of Archie Moore on film.

    So for me that's 3 of the greatest boxers in their finest hours basically

    And Joe Louis? Everyone had their own Joe Louis, Tyson had his Holmes, Holy had his George and his Larry, Larry had his Ali, Ali had his Moore, Louis himself had about 6 aging former champs, Tunney only fought the washed of remnants of Dempsey's leftovers and a left over Dempsey himself, Jack Johnson had his Jim Jeffries, Corbett had his Sullivan - haha at least Rocks one probably trumps any of the others for his historical ranking and level of competitiveness - this was Joe ****in Louis for Christs sake!
     
  11. reznick

    reznick In the 7.2% Full Member

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    Look at Holyfield in the Lewis fights.

    Marciano would never fight at that pace, in that close of a fight.
     
  12. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    Those are actually pretty legitimate points.

    If one fighter is a lot more accomplished, and the other has not achieved a particularly significant win, then that hard to simply overlook!
     
  13. tommygun711

    tommygun711 The Future Full Member

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    And he gets a lot of respect.

    Not sure whats the point of this thread though other than to troll the rocky fans.

    I actually think if Rocky was around today, he would be able to dominate cruisrweight and eventually bulk up to heavyweight and be a great fighter there.

    I think he'd struggle against certain super heavyweights, guys that we would all rank below rocky in an ATG sense.
     
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  14. reznick

    reznick In the 7.2% Full Member

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    It's the imbalance in the way it is said.

    When you approach that debate in a fair way, you'll get good thoughtful answers.

    But if you start by demeaning Marciano, then you've introduced a whole other debate. And you put people in a position where they have to defend Marcianos legacy, and put Tucker under the same fire. And then the conversation gets emotional.

    Which is fun too. Boxing and banter go hand in hand. But if you're looking for a cooperative effort where everybody seeks the truth, you gotta approach it differently.

    idk
     
  15. mrkoolkevin

    mrkoolkevin Never wrestle with pigs or argue with fools Full Member

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    Given your name, I'm not at all surprised that you feel that way! But when did Moore say that Marciano was his best performance? Closest I could find was Moore saying "They asked me if Marciano was the greatest fighter I ever met, and I don't know how to reply. I don't want to seem ungenerous—but it is well to remember that I was 38 when I boxed Marciano."

    And Ezzard Charles' career was clearly on the decline going into his fight with Marciano.