Marciano vs Charels I, a war!

Yeah. Marciano won. You should also know by now I'm insane :rofl

 

How about before the fight? It was a who's who of Boxing Champions! I never seen so many Boxing Champions at one event. Dempsey, Louis,Saddler, Ect...

 

it could be looked at he was a naturally filled out trim 185lb heavyweight with a ton of experience on him. gene tunney was 195lb when he fought dempsey with the same amount of bouts, was he a blown up lightheavyweight with tons of mileage on him? how bout tommy gibbons? same age as charles with near same amount of bouts on his resume when he fought dempsey.

 

Because of the punchrate, workrate he put up under gruelling conditions.. just watch round 15.....i think the walcott fight however shows marcianos ability as an ATG 15 round fighter

Yes and beating a live dangerous version of ezzard charles doesnt matter? charles was the # 1 contender in the heavyweight division and still a great fighter despite being past his prime. the June 1954 charles is better than anyone jack dempsey beat. charles wasnt ali, but he was no washed up deadbeat in there, he was a hungry live dangerous # 1 contender trying to become the first contender in history to recapture the heavyweight crown.


sure no one is saying the charles win was as good as fraziers win over ali, but the 15 round grueller marciano put up certainly rated up there and proved himself clearly a capable 15 round fighter.

 

I dont hold the lost to Johnson against Charles. Charles should have been 3-1 going into Marciano fight 1. I had it 7 rounds to 3 score for Charles vs the Johnson fight. A Clear robbery imo.

Should have been 12 out of 13 fights leading to Marciano.

 

I agree. I scored it 6 rounds to 3 charles with 1 even, charles even knocked him down in the 10th round with a sharp right hand too.

 

A truely great fight.


Saying that Charles traded with Marciano is a subtle misunderstanding of the flow of the fight; Marciano made Charles trade with him because of his workrate and pressure. And that pressure of course, in turn made Ezzard throw many hard shots early to get Rocky's respect and try and keep him off.

Look at the last rounds of Marciano's fights with LaStarza, Moore and Cockell. Are they trading with him? No, they simple can't keep him off.

 

Heavyweight immortality for punching out LaStarza, Cockell and forty plus year old Archie Moore ... none of whom are rated in anyone's top 100 heavyweights ...

SQ: Are you saying the 33 year old Charles was comparable at this stage in his career to 27 year old Tunney that fought Dempsey ?

 

Ring Magazine ranked Archie Moore #29 in their ranking of heavyweights.

 

Bivins, I think, was #26. The question is do you rate fighters on such lists on historical achievements, or go on a p4p basis. Frankly, I think the best way is to have two lists because any combination is arbitrary and confusing. Bivins fought and defeated more good men than almost anyone who was never champion, including even Langford. Jim Jacobs, who certainly saw more films of fighters than almost anyone, named Bivins as the all-time most underrated fighter.

*By the way, you should rethink some of your constant ad hominem circumstancials--if someone thinks such and such a way, it is obviously because of bias and so should be dismissed--I have never met anyone who isn't biased in one way or another. Just because an "expert" agrees with you doesn't make him unbiased.

Lewis was in the #30's, but this was before he fought Holyfield. I think both of their ratings would be quite different today.

 

Charles was 32, not 33. Tunney was 29, not 27. Dempsey DID NOT beat tunney. in fact he won only two rounds out of 20. I specificully said Charles of june 1954 was better than any opponent jack dempsey ever BEAT

 

Moore was 38, not 42. and I know many people including myself who rate archie moore in top 40 heavyweight list. in fact many here do. Archie moore beat the best young heavyweight contenders of the 1950s and he did so in dominating fashion, including over the biggest baddest of the 1950s. Archie Moores heavyweight record is something like 75-3!!!!!