Marciano vs the following punchers

You seem to have a hang up about Don Turner. Pepe Correa was anoying but Sugar Ray Leonard seemed to like him. I respect what any prominent trainer has to say about old timers, even the ones I don’t agree with. They spend a life in boxing forming opinions. Sometimes I enjoy seeing it from their angle. They’re entitled to it because it’s their job to work out ways fighter A) beats fighter B) fighter c) and fighter D). Sometimes they say crazy stuff but that’s okay.

 

We've explained numerous times in numerous threads why Don Turner's interview comments about this type of thing need to be taken with many grains of salt. The man is clearly prone to overheated hot takes and outlandish hyperbole, and there are legitimate questions about his basis of knowledge for assessing Marciano. I get why Marciano fans may want to ignore these things, but let's not pretend that it's outrageous to take them into consideration.

 

Sometimes it’s a trainers job to believe what they say and have the fighter believing in themselves. Consequently they say fantastical things to get the best out of a fighter. There is a logic behind it based on straight forward achievable things of course, but it’s all part of their job. They use their success to fuel a theory but the theory is based on first hand knowledge. So you see, among trainers, one mans outrageous opinion is another mans meat and motivation. If Don Turner is to be taken with a pinch of salt then so are all the others.

 

Lol

 

Yes, I've previously argued that fighters and trainers generally should be taken with a grain of salt. Turner needs to be taken with even more grains of salt than usual though, for the reasons that I mentioned.

 

Beats maybe Dempsey, Louis and Shavers. Looses to the rest. Remember he is 9-0 at Heavy.

 

Frankly, any trainer who utters such a simple-minded pronouncement either has no idea what they're talking about or suffers from a serious case of bias. Either way, it doesn't say anything good about them.

 

He might be qualified to venture his opinion, but that doesn't mean the opinion isn't open for criticism. Saying champion X would KO champion Y with the first punch they throw is just an absurd statement, any way you slice it. It's either completely ludicrous, if taken at face value, or betraying of a vast disrespect for the losing fighter, if taken hyperbolically. In the case of Wlad, it's also something with no past precedent.

Big up Turner as much as you like, but I honestly expect more depth of thought from a man who's been around the sport so long.

 

I would bet huge money marciano knocks out shavers. Guys with bad chins, poor stamina, and questionable heart don’t beat Marciano

 

I have a hang up with you stating Charlie Goldman trained Don Turner ,he didn't!

 

You may be right ,all I'm saying is any man who punches as hard as Shavers has a shot at winning. What fights of his indicated he had questionable heart? I thought he showed commendable courage when Holmes was beating up on him.

 

Don says he did dosnt he?

 

Have to agree with you 100% for once.

 

He "implies" it which isn't the same thing.
Don says ,"cut men are a con ,"and that," hook and jab pads are bull ****".I think the BS comes from him!Especially as Charlie Goldman is considered to be the first boxing trainer to utilise hook and jab pads,by reversing boxing gloves on his hands! He then had prototypes made up.Below you can see him with employing them whilst training Marciano .

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Below is an article disparaging his pronouncement that," cut men are a scam".
http://articles.latimes.com/1994-04-28/sports/sp-51222_1_cut-man

I think Turner is full of it.

 

In Thomas Hausers book “beautiful sickness” Don is quoted as saying he was trained by Charlie Goldman.

“I learned the basics from some very disciplined trainers.” “Fighters today don’t have the teachers that fighters had in the past. They have conditioners and made for TV trainers but I was lucky. Bob Mcquillian, Charlie Goldman, Sid Bell and Al Smith all trained me at different times. What I’m trying to do now is pass on what I learned from them to my guys”