Marciano's Thoughts on Sonny Liston

He beat the BEst, the 200+ heavyweights were wiped out by Lastarza, Moore,Charles,Walcott, even Harold Johnson who lost to Moore beat some of the better big men...the best fighters of that time were the slickters of that era but Charles, Moore and Walcott were slicksters that could PUNCH, Indeed....Fact is they did not weigh a fighter to see who was the best, Marciano KO'd fighters 6"4 and fighters that weighed over 220, the quality of the time was the conditioned fit fighter and a good example of this is Marciano beat the # 1 contender in 5 defences, the # 2 in one defence and won the title from the trickiest Heavyweight ever who was also one of the top punchers...In fact I ask you to produce a more savy champ than Walcott that also had power in both hands.

 

And we know he was as strong as 230 pounders because he proved this in the ring against who ???

I never saw Marciano Liston as Frazier Foreman ... more like Hagler/Vito 2 or Hagler Minter where Marciano gets ripped to pieces, is a bloody mess, badly rocked and stopped ...

 

You have to watch Liston pre type clean up of the heavyweight division, and back to back 1st round KO's over Patterson. They were very impressive as are his gym workouts, and heavy bag work.

Out of the ring, Liston was a king kong type. He could seize the fair maiden with one hand and beat off the cops with the other.

I still have Sonny in my top ten which is not a pure accomplishment top ten.

For what its worth, a young George Foreman was discouraged that his punches didn't bother Liston when the two sparred.

We'll never know for sure if the Ali fights were on the level or not. I suspect at least one of them was a pre-arranged deal. Post Ali, top ten guys didn't exactly line up to face Liston.

 

That is a rather plausible scenario given Listons physical and stylistic advantages but I would add a couple of caveats.

When comparing these two men in terms of size and durability I honestly think that it is too close to call.

Phsical strength cannot readily be determined from body size and some people who fought Marciano said that he was stronger than Nino Valdez. It seems that he was not only verry physical but could use his stature to his advantage when moving an oponent around the ring.

Taking the above into account I think that Liston would have a fight onhis hands.

 

Nothing at all strange with that Janitor mate imo. Like most "Greats" from that era (and before) Rocky probably felt that he had need to boast about how good he was (Remember, we are talking "Pre Ali" here) as a result his ego was wrapped in a cloak of modesty and he may even have taken an almost self-depreciation view on his career, as his comments to Liston suggest. But Rocky would have viewed such depreciation as his right only and woe betide anyone who attempted to trivialise his achievements or suggest he would have been an easy nights work for anyone. A truly great fighter with an indomitable spirit!!!

 

:good Love the picture. Nothing better than a moment that captures a master at work!!!

 

I just see it as a huge stylistic match up challange for Marciano who gives up height, thirty pounds in weight and 15" in reach. Rocky was also a slow starter and a bleeder, other issues that were no great help here ... His syle play directly into Sonny's strengths. Extremely well conditioned, lightning fast boxers were the challenge for Sonny, be it an Ali or a Tunney ... Rocky is just Sonny's best possible type of opponent ..

 

I was referring to Marciano taking Listons punches instead of Moore/Charles/Walcotts punches, not the primeness of those men, even though yes they were past prime. If Marciano is as open as he was against those men when facing Liston he gets smoked

 

He beat the best of his era, which was a weak era with less physically imposing good men, hence light heavyweights competing at HW. Liston would likely make short work of Marciano's comp

Rocky never beat a good big man, it is idiotice to pretend his chin would be as durable against a good big man, his power as effective, or even maintain his ability to land punches.

 

Patterson and Ingo both may KO Rocky for all we know, they would be the 2 best offensive forces Rocky had met. Patterson would certainly outbox and outspeed Rocky early

 

I have seen the earlier variants of Liston (a man who I believe was actually BEYOND 40 years of age by the time he beat Patterson) and he was a monster. Regardless, I believe Marciano was more of a force and as far as all-time champ cred Liston has to fall short.

 

and we would think Holyfield would have been Tyson's.....Not so sure how Sonny would react to a fearless man with subtle skill and extreme power and relentless stamina and aggression....I see Sonny taking a beating in the late Rds and a possible corner quit...Heart would be a strong issue here and although Sonny looked powerful and ponderous, who is to say he hit harder than Jersey Joe Walcott with one punch. Patterson was dropped in almost every fight and was KO'd before. Sonny also had the Tyson intimadation thing going but lets face it he QUIT in 2 fights....He looked like King Kong but was KO'd by Ali and who knows how he reacts to a puncher of Marciano's magnatude with Stamin,power and Heart....I see Sonny quitting on the stool

 

Calling Marciano's power "extreme" is an exagerration. When I think of the top teir of big punching heavyweights, Marciano doesn't make the list.

 

Who makes your list